A possible project.

Discussion in 'DIY Discussion' started by Haselsh1, Dec 18, 2008.

  1. Haselsh1

    Haselsh1 Shaun H

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    My sound system at the moment comprises:

    A Linn Basik turntable with an Alphason Xenon MCS tonearm and an Ortofon OM30 cartridge. An Original 2008F HDCD player imported by me from China into a Gemini PA7000 DJ preamp. This goes into a Samson Servo 600 power amp which in turn powers a pair of small Q Acoustics 1020i speakers.

    The sound for me personally is just about what I want but I've got a bit of a DIY itch. I know that the Gemini preamp is a very cheap unit with a good phono stage as this stage is better than the Graham Slee Gram Amp 1 I was using before this came along. My point: I am thinking of upgrading all of the resistors in this unit for Tantalum types and all of the capacitors for Elna's. Would changing resistors and capacitors make a vast difference to the sound that comes through this unit...? If it changes the sound for the better then ultimately, it has to be worth it. Given the overall budget of my system I'm not about to go and throw away 400 quid on a ready built commercial pre and this is the main thinking behind what I'm planning.

    What do you think...???
     
    Haselsh1, Dec 18, 2008
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  2. Haselsh1

    I-S Good Evening.... Infidel

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    It might make a slight difference.

    No.
     
    I-S, Dec 18, 2008
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  3. Haselsh1

    zanash

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    sorry to disagree....

    I've changed a single resistor in the output stage of a cdp t very great effect so much so that the own then decided to keep the unit rather than buy a new one.

    whole sale changes will not nessearily be cost effective...you need to try and undestand the function of each component.

    any resistor in the signal path will effect the final sound therfore swapping one for a more transparent sounding one will improve performance.

    this is easily demonstrated for those that think other wise !

    you must of course select your new resistors with care I favour vishay as they are relatively cheap and don't sound cold and clinical like holco's ...I'd stay away from metal film types and also the majourity of the cheaper carbon film types.

    As to caps an amp is only as good as its powersupply so if your improving the smoothing caps this will help ...don't neglect the rectifier diodes these can inject huge ammounts of noise if there simple 1nxxxx types ...I favour schottkys but there are other good ones available
     
    zanash, Dec 21, 2008
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  4. Haselsh1

    dreftar

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    One to ponder over - "how little is a big difference" or "how big is a little difference" - all in the ear of the beholder!
     
    dreftar, Dec 21, 2008
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  5. Haselsh1

    Haselsh1 Shaun H

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    Sunday Morning the 21st December

    As a bit of an experiment, I decided to remove the preamp all together this morning and use the Original CD player straight into the power amp using the input level controls to govern the volume. The difference was truly amazing. OK, I agree, a 90 quid DJ preamp is never going to be very 'hi-fi' but the sound has opened up so much. There is now so much acoustic to listen to with the overall sound no longer dry and dead. Vocals sound much more realistic, especially female vocals on my favourite Incognito CD. I'm still getting the benefit of the Samson Servo 600 power amp with all of the slam and extra bass power that this kind of amplifier supplies but I am of course no longer limited by a cheap preamp.

    Overall, this changes my plans for 2009. I am no longer looking for a valve preamp but maybe a valve phono stage for the Linn Basik. This in itself is going to be upgraded to an LP12 via ebay when I have the funds and a suitable LP12 becomes available. The cartridge is going to turn into a Dynavector DV10X5. How's that...???
     
    Haselsh1, Dec 21, 2008
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  6. Haselsh1

    dreftar

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    I think you should consider a TVR passive pre - certainly floats my boat - the best pre is none at all!
     
    dreftar, Dec 21, 2008
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  7. Haselsh1

    hifinutt

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    hifinutt, Jan 10, 2009
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  8. Haselsh1

    ShinOBIWAN

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    By intentionally adding pleasing colour to the sound?

    That seems like one step forward and two in reverse.
     
    ShinOBIWAN, Jan 10, 2009
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  9. Haselsh1

    murray johnson

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    Not quite a direct connection. They are discussing whether an active pre should be used instead of the Wadia's inbuilt digital volume control. I'd agree that it should. With regard to a TVC passive pre being the same as 'none at all' I'd also beg to differ. The Tribute AVC's are perhaps the best of the breed that I've tried but I don't even think they are as satisfactory as a good active pre can be.
     
    murray johnson, Jan 11, 2009
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  10. Haselsh1

    Arlequen Vinyl Addict

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    I absolutely agree with Zanash
     
    Arlequen, Jan 11, 2009
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  11. Haselsh1

    robM

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    What is a transparent resistor? And unless you have an electronics degree, what is signal path. I bet most non-electronic minded audiophiles think the signal path is the path the audio signal travels on....unfortunately it isn't!

    Zanash and Arlequen - would you consider the 'feedback path' signal path even though a 'tiny' percentage of the signal is actually on this path. Is any part of the DC line signal path? Does audio ground form the any part of the signal path?
    I did a degree in electronics but rarely use it but can tell you that the signal path is not what you think it is.
     
    robM, Jan 11, 2009
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  12. Haselsh1

    Haselsh1 Shaun H

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    Even though I've added nothing to this thread for a while I have been taking an interest in what has been said by various contributors. In case anyone is interested, I am still toying with the idea of an NVA P50 Passive Preamp as a control box for my system. Electrically it is compatible with the Samson power amp. If anyone can add anything I would be interested.
     
    Haselsh1, Jan 11, 2009
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  13. Haselsh1

    YNMOAN Trade - AudioFlat

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    By all means change components for the fun of experimentation but the results are in no way guaranteed. My experience is that, ultimately one is not changing the circuit, and the correct specific make of component varies depending on the position and role within that circuit. Having said that, resistors can make a difference and capacitors can make a big difference. You really have to be prepared to experiment a lot with different combinations of capacitors to be sure of actually achieving an improvement, rather than just a change.
     
    YNMOAN, Jan 11, 2009
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  14. Haselsh1

    bottleneck talks a load of rubbish

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    " try before you buy " is my advice if going from active to passive. You may like or dislike the inherant change.

    Dont rely on reviews or printed word of any sort. All passive pre-amps sound 'different' to active ones, try it and see if you like the shift in compromises and priorities it brings


    Have fun!
     
    bottleneck, Jan 11, 2009
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  15. Haselsh1

    zanash

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    I bet there are great many people who'd be very interested in what you consider to be the signal path ........

    so are you going to enlighten us ?

    I never consider myself to old to learn and would hang off your every word with your obvious superior knowledge in this field.
     
    zanash, Jan 12, 2009
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  16. Haselsh1

    robM

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    Zanash - What I find hilarious is your use of the term 'signal path' when it's quite obvious you have no idea what you are on about. How can you sit there and pretend to educate on a subject you know nothing about. And what on earth is a 'transparent resistor' :confused: And how do you know after changing a resistor for one that is 'transparent' that it actually makes a better sound?

    It's far better to take all these unknowns out of the equation as the permutations are endless in a circuit that contains at least 30components per channel. A far easier thing to do is not to guess but to re-design, and if you really want to know why...build a simple crystal set (that was my first - about 40 years ago), change the only 6 components in the circuit for 'transparent' ones and see if it sounds better. You'll find you have to do a lot more than that....
     
    robM, Jan 12, 2009
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  17. Haselsh1

    zanash

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    I suspect you know about as much as I do or less ....otherwise you'd be offering to help spread this wonderous knowledge that you seem to think you have and everyone should know ..

    seems to me you very quick to ridicule people and very slow to offer any advice ...actually slow suggests you've offered useful information in the past ....having ploughed through your turgid 187 posts I find I'm at a complete loss to find any positive advice ..just cynical comments and missed opportunities to help people.

    so why are you posting on the diy section ?
     
    zanash, Jan 12, 2009
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  18. Haselsh1

    robM

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    I can't wait until I have caught up with your 10,000 posts...you must be so proud, and such a big shot. You actually went through all 187 posts....you've got time!
     
    robM, Jan 12, 2009
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