Black Gates versus Philips electrolytics..

Hi all,

I have lots of Philips caps in my various amps etc. how good are these? What sort of improvement is to be gained by switching to something like Black Gates? I am aware that it very much depends which ones you change but if I was to blanket the lot could I get a big improvement?

Also interested as my ARC V140 monoblocks have 12 very very big capacitors between them.

Thanks, Tim

 

Black gates are an acquired taste.....IMO they take forever to run in [some say never]

try the lesser caps like Elna stargets or oscon.....bhc aerovox will be hard to beat as supply caps.

 

In the right positions, BG caps are a must. Nothing touches them.
Yes, they take some time to burn in, and they go through some funny phases (one day they sound good, the next minute they sound bloated.....)

But after 100 hours, they suddenly gel. The sound is liquid and revealing. Tons of detail......

Elna Cerafine are good too. Where do you want to stick your BG's?

 

Thanks guys,
The Philips caps are in the power supply. I'll take a look at the Elna range too. Basically the power supply caps are massive! I'm thinking of just doing some guess work and replacing caps at random to see what happens. The ARC's I own are on really big circuit boards so it should be easy to do the soldering.

 

You cant get Black Gates anymore can you? I thought they stopped production last year?

 

If you want to try some lower-cost, decent caps try:

Rubycon ZA - This is rubycon's top low-ESR cap now that they don't make the BG anymore (which rubycon manufactured for Jelmax). Use for decoupling analogue psus
Elna RJH - Elna's top "standard" low-ESR outside of the audiophile (and audiophile priced) Cerafine and Starget ranges. Use for decoupling analogue psus
Sanyo OSCON - The de-facto decoupling electrolytic for digital circuits. Improved HF performance compared to many electrolytics.

Also, for low voltage stuff you will almost certainly be much better off with a surface-mount ceramic or surface mount polyester cap as these offer very significantly lower parasitic inductance than any leaded package. Try bypassing 1uF+ electrolytics with an 0603 100nF ceramic if they're not already bypassed, as this gives a very significant reduction in HF noise.

 

Dont you need a special machine to put surface-mount stuff on a board?

 

No. Contrary to popular belief, SMD is much easier to work with by hand than through-hole. The only thing you need anything special to work with are BGA chips.

There's also simple physical limits.... 0603 is the smallest that you can work with by hand easily (I have done 0402 but it's far from a pleasant experience...). For those with poorer eyesight and less steady hand you're probably better off staying at 0805.

 

It's pretty easy to solder by hand. I have used here 0805 parts and have soldered 0603 by hand.

 

Contrary to what most believe, Blackgates are still available (due to stock levels) and will be for several more years, I have that from a reliable source. In addition, Rubycon are also musing over the possibility of putting BG's back into production.

JTB

 

Per-anders, what basic tools does one need to learn SMD soldering? Do you need all kinds of expensive rework stuff?

I'm just totally scared of SMD.

BTW, I agree with Isaac, Rubycon ZA and Elna RJH very good as PSU filter caps / pre-post regulators. Don't like Philips/BC or Nichicon.
________
Ford Tourneo Connect History

 

Weren't they an 'organic' dielectric 'lytic cap? I'm sure someone will cottage industry them - if they are important. What I find more disturbing is the thought that there are 'years' of stock in a supply chain for a component that degrades over time [especially when unused]

 

Hi Graham, I'll be honest I've never really rated/like B/G's a lot of guys swear by them, I feel used in PSU's only were they any good.
Mind you they had a sheep like following

 

Black Gates are great but do take many hours to sound their best.

 

The special thing about the black gate was the use of carbon graphite in the electrolyte.

All you need for SMD soldering is a reasonably fine soldering iron (although I personally don't like too fine an iron because they have no heat capacity), a pair of tweezers and some flux.