NHS - Why do they always get it wrong?

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by amazingtrade, Apr 26, 2004.

  1. amazingtrade

    amazingtrade Mad Madchestoh fan

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    Why can't they just be honest? I was told 2.2 months ago I need an operation within 2 months and its two weeks late now.

    I phoned two weeks ago and they said I should get a letter very soon. Every time I phone they just fob me off, mean while my condtion is slowly going worse, it can't be left much longer, its started to get noticeable now.

    When I get a job I think I will go private. I am not bothered about the wait so much its the not knowing thats annoying me. If they said in February the opp would be in June I would have been fine with that but as it stands I have no idea if I will be in hospital next week or not.

    I am very busy with work and university now as well.

    The worst thing the operation is quite simple but if its left it will be become serious.
     
    amazingtrade, Apr 26, 2004
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  2. amazingtrade

    tones compulsive cantater

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    Cheer up, AT, it could be worse - the news here is full of the story of a heart transplant patient who was given the wrong heart - from the wrong blood group. She didn't survive, and I suspect neither will a few hospital careers in Zürich.
     
    tones, Apr 26, 2004
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  3. amazingtrade

    penance Arrogant Cock

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    Is it life threatening?


    Most NHS staff are very busy trying to keep up with the amount of work they have. Maybe you should speak to your MP as it would seem the fault lies with hospital managers and not the medical staff.

    If it was simple you can do it yourself, why not have a try?

    I do sympathise AT, but dont blame the NHS (doctors/nurses etc).

    No operation is simple, they all put the patient at risk.
    Think yourself lucky, at least you are on a waiting list. In some countries you would not have the opertunity of treatment.
     
    penance, Apr 26, 2004
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  4. amazingtrade

    amazingtrade Mad Madchestoh fan

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    Yeah true It is management I am blaming. I know certain things that go on in the NHS like staff sending loads of joke emails to each other which wastes and time and cost money. My mum used to me medical secretary in a hospital and all her friends still work there. They all say how much time is wasted and how their is too many managers and not enough doctors.

    I know there is waiting lists etc but if they just told me 2 months it would be in 6 months time and gave me a date and least I would know where I stand. I can't plan anything at the moment.

    The operation is for a hernia, its quite a serious one hence supposidly being added to the emergency waiting list rather than the 6 month one (which in reallity seems to be 1 year from people I know who has had it done).

    It is only life threatening if it becomes instrangulated but the doctor said if its not done soon (within two months) then the risk of this is very real).

    If that did happen to me at the very least I would be disabled, I would need a bag with a tube etc). This why I am worrying about it.
     
    amazingtrade, Apr 26, 2004
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  5. amazingtrade

    blogger

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    be carefull - private is very expensive - I have just been for a check up for a lump which has been diagnosed as quite innocent - but the bill for a scan and visit to consultant to interperate - total time in hospital 20mins - including very nice ground coffee - £560 !!!!
     
    blogger, Apr 26, 2004
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  6. amazingtrade

    lordsummit moderate mod

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    I have a lot of friends who work in the NHS, they would fix you tomorrow if they could, but it is probably a lot urgent cases that need theatre time taking up your place. They have to prioritise. It probably was 2 months when they saw you. Things change. At least you don't have to pay. You'll live I'm sure. One day you might be urgent and someone else will have to wait a while. It's no good moaning about it. Your turn will come.
     
    lordsummit, Apr 26, 2004
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  7. amazingtrade

    Paul Ranson

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    It's the NHS that's (not) providing the bad service. Who else should he blame?

    In many countries it would have been dealt with by now. I suggest AT get the E111 form from his Post Office and takes a day trip to France.

    Paul
     
    Paul Ranson, Apr 26, 2004
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  8. amazingtrade

    amazingtrade Mad Madchestoh fan

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    This what I mean I just think the NHS isn't really working and its not about money. Its so badly managed they have manager managing managers to manage their managers. This money would be better spent on more doctors/hospitals etc.

    Other parts of the NHS I can't fault such as their hearing aid service, first class, although this may depend on the local authority.

    My 25 year old cousin needs a scan because his GP said he may have cancer, that was 6 months ago and he still hasn't heared anything.

    I would rather pay a bit more extra money and get better service.

    I know private is expensive but can't you take insurance out for that?

    Finally the france idea sounds very good :p
     
    amazingtrade, Apr 26, 2004
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  9. amazingtrade

    The Devil IHTFP

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    Your hernia is unlikely to become life-threatening.

    The problem with the NHS is funding. The 'management' argument holds no water. The great British taxpayer/voter has decided that it doesn't want to pay any extra tax for a decent service. So be it.
     
    The Devil, Apr 26, 2004
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  10. amazingtrade

    Paul Ranson

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    Bub,

    There's clearly more to it than funding. NHS Funding is rising hugely, taxation has risen hugely, the NHS experience hasn't markedly improved except in standards of decoration and automatic doors. The more we pay the more we expect.

    Paul
     
    Paul Ranson, Apr 26, 2004
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  11. amazingtrade

    amazingtrade Mad Madchestoh fan

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    Exactly there is billions of money going into the NHS, in fact its not far of the with the best of europe yet. The problem is the top end management. In true British fashion we need managers to manage managers. In Europe the system s much more efficient.

    There was a report published recently that said despite the government investing billions more into the NHS it has had very little effect on waiting times.

    I am sure we would all rather pay 20% VAT instead of 17.5% if it mean't the NHS would improve but I still don't really think money is the main problem.

    I am will phone them up tomorrow anyway and see if the secratary can let me know why I have not got the letter yet it was supposed to be sent out weeks ago. This is just for the pre-op appointment as well.
     
    amazingtrade, Apr 26, 2004
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  12. amazingtrade

    Hex Spurt

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    Whoa there horsey!! Just be careful whose money you start throwing around. We had a VAT rise from 15 to 17.5% in the late 80's, we also saw VAT added to fuel and takeaway food and I have seen very little improvement despite the extra billions clawed in by the treasury.

    Something like 50% of my salary goes on direct Tax and NI at the moment, and every year I see both National and Local Government helping itself to a larger portion of my family income.

    I then contribute another lump of cash through indirect taxation through fuel duty, VAT, Insurance Premium Tax, Corporation Tax, Duty in alcohol and tobbaco, tax on my savings and countless other little bites the treasury takes.

    Now the Government is making life harder for those who can save by cutting back on the already meagre tax breaks an average income family can take advantage of.

    Result of all this? - a sterling health service? - No! Public transport systems the envy of the world? - No! A road infrastructure capable of simply meeting demand? - No!

    There's no easy fix, but chucking more money at the problem isn't always the solution. Businesses go bust like that, but this is a lesson the Government has yet to learn.
     
    Hex Spurt, Apr 26, 2004
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  13. amazingtrade

    The Devil IHTFP

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    Yes, but there will obviously be a lag phase because it takes 5 undergraduate years, plus about 5 postgraduate years to train a GP. Add another 5 years to that for a consultant. Unless we 'buy-in' docs from Europe, which may happen.

    There is also a major problem with recruiting nurses because the job, pay & conditions are not attractive.

    The problem is the top end management

    Please produce some evidence to support this assertion.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 26, 2004
    The Devil, Apr 26, 2004
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  14. amazingtrade

    amazingtrade Mad Madchestoh fan

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    My mums friends all work in NHS and they all say they don't do half the work they had do in the 1970's. The British are very well kown for not being efficient. For example the the railways fiasco.

    The government are trying to streamline the NHS but it will take ages.

    The NHS needs to try and attract more foreign doctors to make up for the tempory short fall I think.
     
    amazingtrade, Apr 26, 2004
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  15. amazingtrade

    Paul Ranson

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    I don't think there's a shortage of GPs or consultants, compared to the shortage of facilities and plain inefficiency of organisation.

    FWIW why am I paying loads more now for consultants 15 years down the line? And why are those consultants-to-be also paying their own way through the system? Doesn't add up does it.

    The NHS already seems to be full of Eastern European doctors and other professionals, not to mention South Africans and Australians. Maybe it's different in Scotland?

    FWIW why does AT have to wait for a letter? Why can't he just check the database out directly over the Internet?

    Paul
     
    Paul Ranson, Apr 26, 2004
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  16. amazingtrade

    amazingtrade Mad Madchestoh fan

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    amazingtrade, Apr 26, 2004
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  17. amazingtrade

    wolfgang

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    If you know how to do this why don't you volunteer your service to your local hospital? Help them set it up. Otherwise it would have to cough up another few nurses' salary to provide this service. I ask the nurses at our local hospital Special Care Baby Unit why they are so good. She suggested it is because the local has been very generous. They have raised so much donation money that they could buy the best equipments available. Since then when I pay attention I notice in our local hospitals there are certainly lots of local volunteers around helping to make it what it is today.

    Problem is the organisation of a health service is getting more complicated. Even if you do offer your service for free be prepare to fight harder then expected to get over lots of red tape that may be involved.
     
    wolfgang, Apr 27, 2004
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  18. amazingtrade

    Sgt Rock

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    Out of interest does anyone know how big the NHS is ?

    The answer is the worlds third bigest employee, behind the Chinese Army and the Indian Railway.

    I was quite shocked when I was told :eek:
     
    Sgt Rock, Apr 27, 2004
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  19. amazingtrade

    Hex Spurt

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    The NHS has escalating costs for several reasons. IMO the most significant factors are:

    * longer life expectancy
    * advances in medical technology improving the range of conditions that can be successfully treated
    * wider use of high cost medical equipment such as MRI scanners
    * wage pressure compared to the private sector
    * generally declining health of the nation – obesity, heart conditions, rising occurrences of eczema and asthma in children for example
    * legacy problems from our heavy industry - lung problems for Miners as an example
    * costs of bureaucracy – chasing Govt targets and playing politics to please the bean counters
    * higher expectations of the general public
    * inappropriate use of resources - e.g. ambulances called out for minor ailments, visiting the GP because of a cold

    Some of the above are inevitable, and others are to be expected in any developed country with an aging population. I even agree that the NHS needs some good managers to allow the Doctors and Nurses to do their job more efficiently.

    If we want an improved health service then we should use a bit more common sense. Taking better care of our own health would reduce the low level burden on the NHS. To make this happen though we have to stop being so self-centred. This is easier said than done, particularly when the safety net of a funded health service is waiting to catch you if you fall.

    Hex.
     
    Hex Spurt, Apr 27, 2004
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  20. amazingtrade

    Paul Ranson

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    NHS IT budget

    substantial

    Expect overruns and extra costs. It's mad. I don't think walking into AT's local clinic and offering to fix it for free is going to get me very far. I'd like £1m at least to get taken seriously...

    Paul
     
    Paul Ranson, Apr 27, 2004
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