Resurrecting a dead CD63 KI

Discussion in 'DIY Discussion' started by clogman, Mar 18, 2006.

  1. clogman

    clogman

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2006
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
    First, excellent forum. I learned more about hifi and improving sound in a day of browsing than I'd done in years of reading hifi magazines.

    Second, apologies for being a complete novice when it comes to the inside of a CD player. All I know is, you put a CD in and sound comes out. This I hope to change now I've found this forum. I am pretty handy with the soldering iron and screwdriver, though, having built and rebuilt numerous PCs from the groung up.

    Third, my CD63KI has died for again. It's been owned since new for more years than I can remember, not really used that much (barely a couple of hours per week). The first time a fault popped up, it started skipping like mad and needed some repair work (don't aks me what was done, I have no idea) but came back just fine.

    About a month ago, it point blank refused to play anything. A disc goes in, the display says the word "disc", the display keeps saying the word "disc", and nothing else happens. I have tried jumping tracks, other discs, compressed air, but still the same lack of response when a disc goes in.

    I took the lid off and can see a black plastic frame that retracts and holds the CD, with a sticker on it saying Philips L1210/11. Hmmm. Maybe this is the wrong thing that was added at the repair? This all looks very dust-free and works very smoothly, but a disc goes in and does not rotate at all, it just gets grabbed above and below and the LCD on the front says "disc".

    I read somewhere about a new transport from Grandata. Again, excusing my complete ignorance, but is the transport the entire assembly including laser and motor? Does my problem sound like it's fixable with a new transport, or is it going to be something more terminal?

    I really want to get this player up and running again; there's only so much music you can listen to in a car before you long for a room full of sound.

    And besides, I'd like to start dabbling in the dark arts of clocks and upgrades.:)
     
    clogman, Mar 18, 2006
    #1
    1. Advertisements

  2. clogman

    Anex Thermionic

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2005
    Messages:
    1,434
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    London
    The disc not spinning doesn't have to be a transport problem, if the transport isn't recieving a clock signal it won't do anything. So if you had a replacement transport that could suggest it isn't that as its new or it could be that it was a duff one that prematurely died. Which doesn't help you one bit. Have you done simple stuff like gone over all the connectors to the boards and made sure they're properly pushed into the sockets?
     
    Anex, Mar 18, 2006
    #2
    1. Advertisements

  3. clogman

    clogman

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2006
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
    Thanks for reading. I should have been clearer.

    The repair was done about 4-5 years ago, to solve the 'skipping' problem. The new "disc" problem cropped up about a month or so ago; I suppose something could have died on the original repair.

    I haven't ordered a new transport yet from Grandata, until someone (hopefully) tells me that it's the most likely fault. And, as an aside, what exactly will a new transport entail?

    As an update, I've got the entire transport assembly out now. The section that holds the laser lens and CD motor is badged by Philips, VAM1201J.

    It looks like the repair shop used some compatible Philips items, rather than Marantz items. Granted they might be identical, but other threads mention the CDM12.1 transport. Is this Philips one likely to be an issue here?
     
    clogman, Mar 18, 2006
    #3
  4. clogman

    Tenson Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2003
    Messages:
    5,947
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Kent, UK
    Philips IS Marantz. I'm not sure whether or not that is the exact right component they used though.
     
    Tenson, Mar 18, 2006
    #4
  5. clogman

    felix part-time Horta

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2003
    Messages:
    757
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    dead
    The VAM1201J is the correct replacement for the 12.1 - they are the same thing.

    Have you tried reading the service mode? Put the thing together, plug in and turn the unit on while holding down the 'Stop' and 'play' buttons. The player will then step through a series of tests and give you a result code identifying fault(s). You can also play discs in this mode as normal, and turning the unit off then on again clears the test mode. Try it, I'll dig out the service manual and look up the results (can't remember offhand!)
     
    felix, Mar 19, 2006
    #5
  6. clogman

    clogman

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2006
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
    As ever, you guys are a mine of useful information.
    Re-assembling the player and running the test gave a message:
    P 00
    Tempted to say it's apt.
    Needless to say, I checked and re-checked all the internal wires that could have come lose and there was nothing.
    The transport gives a small 'kick' when I try to jump track, for example, but the machine still refuses to spin the CD and still comes up "disc" on the display.

    Many thanks again for any more help or info.
     
    clogman, Mar 19, 2006
    #6
  7. clogman

    Tenson Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2003
    Messages:
    5,947
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Kent, UK
    Its a simple thing to suggest but have you tried leaving it powered off at the wall for a night? It sounds like the logic of the player might have got its pants in a twist I think. Might just need time to reset.
     
    Tenson, Mar 19, 2006
    #7
  8. clogman

    andi

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2005
    Messages:
    111
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    basingstoke
    try cleaning the lens. Cotton bud and lens solution and GENTLY rub the lens. Disc won't spin until it detects a disc
     
    andi, Mar 19, 2006
    #8
  9. clogman

    clogman

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2006
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
    Thanks, but it's been powered off for a while before starting this discussion, and still has the same problem.
    The lens looks very clean from what I can tell. When the tray is retracted back into the player, the lens assembly rises up and "bounces" up and down. I can obviously only see this when no CD is in the tray. However, putting a piece of paper above the lens doesn't show up any bright spot. I tried this in a darkened room and really can't tell if anything is coming off the laser.

    So back to my original question - what do I actually get if I buy a new transport? Does that include the laser? If not, and the laser is at fault, where can I find a new one?

    Keep all suggestions and ideas coming.
     
    clogman, Mar 19, 2006
    #9
  10. clogman

    leo

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2004
    Messages:
    135
    Likes Received:
    0
    Could be the spindle motor, have you tried gently spinning the disc after the drawer has just closed and pressing play?
    The little disc that rotates the cd underneath may need adjusting, if its too high or too low it can cause problems

    Check the main board for any crappy solder joints, also those little plugs can be dodgy, with all my cdp's I take out the little metal plugs in the plastic cases and recrimp and solder them up.

    CPC used to sell lasers, you normally only get the actual laser so you will have to dismantle the drawer etc to fit it, if you do try fitting a new one please be very careful:) they are delicate especially the ribbon cable, they sometimes also come with a solder short on the little pcb which needs to be removed, this just helps protect from static

    Edit
    Have a search through this lot :)
    http://cpc.farnell.com/jsp/endecaSearch/searchPage2.jsp?Ntt=laser&Nty=1&N=411&Ntk=gensearch
     
    leo, Mar 19, 2006
    #10
  11. clogman

    Tenson Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2003
    Messages:
    5,947
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Kent, UK
    Yes, transport is the laser, tray, suspension system.
     
    Tenson, Mar 19, 2006
    #11
  12. clogman

    felix part-time Horta

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2003
    Messages:
    757
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    dead
    OK. Sounds like the laser is dead. The 'bobbing' is that laser trying to find focus, and until it does the disc motor will not spin-up.

    While the laser is trying to focus (and not in service mode) you should be able to see a dark red pinpoint on paper as you describe fairly easily (or find some tracing paper, and view from above). No laser = no focus found, and the rest of load process fails.

    Here's the complete service mode check - try stepping through this first:
    [​IMG]

    The replacement is just the laser, disc and tracking motor assembly, which is fitted withn the loader/tray mechanism. From the CD6000 thread, 'Grandata has the CDM12.1 for £16+vat here (scroll down):
    http://www.grandata.co.uk/acatalog/G...UMBER_676.html
    When I last ordered here they actually sent the VAM1201 which is the updated replacement, and works just fine. It is easy to fit - this page should help walk you through the swap:
    http://diyparadise.com/cd46/cd46repair.html
    - it shows the marantz CD46, but the CD63 is identical.

    BTW the previous skipping problem is classically solved by cleaning and re-lubricating the sled rail - the early 12.1mechs were put together with a grease that hardens with time, leading to the laser sled sticking (well-known irritation!)
     
    felix, Mar 19, 2006
    #12
  13. clogman

    zanash

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2003
    Messages:
    3,826
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Notts.
    That's great info !
     
    zanash, Mar 19, 2006
    #13
  14. clogman

    clogman

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2006
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
    Great info indeed - a very big thankyou. This confirms what I was starting to think - I just wanted someone far more knowledgeable than me to tell me that replacing the transport with the kit from Grandata was actually going to cure the problem, and that it wasn't something else entirely.

    I'll call tomorrow to place the order and give you a nod when the repair's done.

    I contacted the only 'decent' hi-fi shop near here on Friday last week, giving them the same details I posted here. Much sucking of teeth later, they said that a repair would typically cost £150-£200, and that's if parts were still available (which they doubted), so I might as well come and audition some new £400 CD player in one of their listening rooms. Customer service? Nah, never heard of it mate.

    Many thanks to all here for such a speedy response and for making sure I was pointing in the right direction.

    Now, about those clock mods....


    ADDENDUM
    I went through all the service steps you detailed, felix, and it did indeed come up with error code 2 - a focus error. Thanks again.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 19, 2006
    clogman, Mar 19, 2006
    #14
  15. clogman

    clogman

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2006
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
    Awesome work, men. My KI lives again.

    And I should also praise Grandata - I ordered the part yesterday at 11:45, it arrived today at 11:45, exceptionally well packed.

    Took about 30 minutes to de-solder all the necessaries and get everything back in place, and now it sounds fabulous.

    Thanks again to all involved.

    For future reference, here's another step-by-step guide:
    http://iangclark.net/projects/CD63/CD63.html
     
    clogman, Mar 21, 2006
    #15
  16. clogman

    andi

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2005
    Messages:
    111
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    basingstoke
    :cool:
     
    andi, Mar 21, 2006
    #16
  17. clogman

    felix part-time Horta

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2003
    Messages:
    757
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    dead
    Cool!
     
    felix, Mar 23, 2006
    #17
  18. clogman

    popi

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2007
    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hi, got a problem with my 10 yr old Cd63 . The plastic gears were broken, so when i press the eject button, it makes cluncky noise and tray refuse to come out and likewise fail to go in. All i can do now is to use my hand to pull it out with the help of a tooth pick and push it in when i load the CD.
    Questions :
    1) Is the plastic gears part of the VAM1201 or CDM12.1 ?
    2) Any way to buy the spare part ; just the gear alone ..
    3) what shoul i do ? any other alternative... understand this is an obsolete model.....

    Hope i can really resurrect this baby. It sounds wonderful after mods.

    Thank you in advance for your helps/advices
     
    popi, Jan 8, 2007
    #18
  19. clogman

    lauriemills

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2010
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    0
    Help! Old favourite CD63 KI sig dead

    Hi Guys,

    I know this is an old thread, but it seemed to answer my needs but.......

    I have followed the advice here and replaced the laser and mech (it originally shower the "Focus Error" when running the diagnostic) with a new one from Grandata.

    Followed the instructions to the letter, but no joy. Laser bobs up and down but does not focus, and "Disc" appears in the display when switching unit on, and it opens the disc drawer.

    Any ideas?
     
    lauriemills, Dec 8, 2010
    #19
  20. clogman

    Sonusthree Coaxial Kid

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2006
    Messages:
    42
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Brighton, UK
    Hi Laurie. What error does it show now?

    My own experience of these mechs is that they can be unreliable even when new.
     
    Sonusthree, Dec 9, 2010
    #20
    1. Advertisements

Ask a Question

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

You'll need to choose a username for the site, which only take a couple of moments (here). After that, you can post your question and our members will help you out.