Richard Strauss - Four Last etc.

[Coda II]

Does any one have views on current interpretations/interpreters of Strauss songs ? Leaving aside Schwarzkopf and Norman's Four Last (with which we are all very happy) (?) are there any one of todays sopranos or recordings that people rate highly ?
I would highlight Christine Schäfer who does not seem to record a great deal and the only complete disc I have of hers is of Schumann, but she recorded a Mozart/Strauss selection some years ago which is still my most played disc.

 

[alanbeeb]

Soile Isokoski with Marek Janowski conducting can't remember what orchestra on Ondine. I also have Norman/Masur, Schwarzkopf/Szell, Janowitz/Karajan and Studer/Sinopli.

The only one of these I would consign to the 2nd hand shop would be Janowitz/Karajan, all the others are more than worthwhile. But Isokoski tops the list.

 

[Tom Alves]

Difficult one this. I did a search for these a few years back. Those who had the voice didn't have the music and vice versa. In the end my father gave me Kiri Te Kanawa/Andrew Davis/LSO which until something better comes a long will suffice.

Wonderful music

 

[GrahamN]

What a coincidence - I actually played a couple of those (Norman and Isokoski) to Merlin when he dropped around yesterday. I actually find these quite complementary recordings - conjouring up completely different moods - so would be quite hard pushed to say one was better than the other. Norman is much more internalised and overtly impassioned, Isokoski more conversational i.e. identifying more with the late Strauss style of Capriccio - a valid interpretation, but I see this music as identifying more with to his early tone-poem days, but with the long sight of a lifetime's experience (and not just because of the Tod und Verklaerung quotation). Pushed though I'd take the Norman - although I think Merlin preferred the Isokoski. (BTW her orchestra is the Berlin RSO).

No way could I consign Janowitz to the 2nd hand shop as that was the recording I grew up with and still love (although currently being TT-less the LP hasn't had an airing for a year or two) - same kind of honeyed sound as Norman, but grossly different speeds. I'm afraid I've never got on with any recording I've heard of Schwarzkopf though - so that one will not be gracing my shelves.

The other one I do listen to a lot is Renee Fleming / Christoph Eschenbach, who take pretty much a mid-line approach between the Norman and Isokoski/FLott approaches. If I had to have only one recording though I'd also probably take her over Isokoski (but not in preference to Norman).

I heard Schaefer singing these live at the RFH, and Isokoski doing the Brentano Lieder (same venue). Both were actually rather disappointing, Isokoski in particular having nowhere near enough puff to sustain the lines in that hall - so everything was very hurried, nervously trying to get the line over and done with before she ran out of wind. The recording is much better. Schaefer did show promise though, although the voice was a bit small and I didn't feel she gererally got inside the songs at all, but could be great with another 5-10 years experience.

Fleming in the same venue though (mixed recital including Dvorak's "To the moon" and the closing scene from Capriccio) had no problems whatever, even though her glory days are coming to an end, and her peak was probably about 10 years ago. I also heard Barbara Frittoli at the Proms, and she was absolutely dreadful - she clearly didn't know the songs (singing from a score) and she gave them as much meaning as the telephone directory. Unfortunately I missed Fleming's 4 Last Songs at the Proms 3(?) years ago - friends there said it was probably the highlight of the season.

What about Karita Mattila? Her Strauss - Salome in particular - is attracting rave reviews the world over (and her Arabella at the ROH was pretty good - although I find the character completely repellent). I see she's recorded them with Abbado, but haven't heard it (and she failed to turn up for a booking last year at the Barbican). Barbara Bonney was also pretty wonderful in the same production of Arabella.

Another one that may be worth a shot at some time (although she doesn't seem to have recorded them yet) is Christine Brewer. I've heard her be wonderful live in Wagner (Walkure-Brunnhilde), Janacek (Glagolitic Mass), Schoenberg (Gurrelieder-Tove), Mahler (Sym 8). Her voice may be a bit too heavy for the 4 Last Snogs though - I did hear her do some Strauss songs on a R3 Wigmore recital and she clearly wasn't comfortable in e.g. (IIRC) Caecilie and Zueignung although was rather better in "Ruhe, meine Seele". She probably had problems reining her huge voice in for the more intimate venue. She was also fairly comprehensively outsung by Susan Graham (but then who wouldn't be) in Barber's Vanessa at the Barbican.

Not quite sure how she translates from opera to song, but there was an absolutely overwhelming performance (barely staged) as Octavian from Katrina Karneus last year. The whole thing absolutely blew me away (also as it was Ann Evans' farewell performance, as the Marschallin). Completely outshone Angelika Kirchschlager at the ROH this year - who was rather one dimensional. Certainly one to watch. Will be seeing Kirchschlager and Bonney again at the Barbican in Feb, but unfortunately not in Strauss.

(Definitely not one-dimensional!) Deborah Voigt is also carving out a bit of notoriety for herself, but may not be there yet. Her performance of Wagner at this year's Proms was a bit characterless - Isolde was better than her Wesedonck Lieder, but both are supposed to be better than her Strauss at present.

Heading a bit off topic - the best mezzos I've heard in the last couple of years have to be Susan Graham and Alice Coote (a stunning Berlioz Nuits d'Ete), and the best alto by a country mile has to be Anna Larsson (Mahler 3, Erda). I've really gone off Petra Lang recently - I now find her extrovert dramatics rather irritating, and get in the way of musical interpretation (e.g. compare her recent Mahler 3 with Chailly vs Larsson for the 1999 Abbado - no contest, although the part clearly lies too low for her). Her Sieglinde wasn't too bad though (although it showed up that she really isn't a full soprano either).

As to the original question - one single name for Strauss interpretation singing today? Probably Fleming still, although that creamy tone is clearly on its way out, and we'll need a new heroine soon. Maybe Mattila?

 

[Tom Alves]

Her voice may be a bit too heavy for the 4 Last Snogs though

A bit Freudian, methinks.

Katrina Karneus should be a good bet. I have her singing the Berlioz "Nuits d'Ete" which are stunning but I was a little disapoointed by her 4 last songs.

 

[PeteH]

I'm afraid I've never got on with any recording I've heard of Schwarzkopf though - so that one will not be gracing my shelves.

:yikes:

The stereo Four Last Songs with Szell is IMO one of the most ravishingly, overwhelmingly beautiful records of anything, ever, and would definitely be a Desert Island Disc of mine. The only problem is she's recorded a bit too close, but the sound she produces is just so meltingly gorgeous that you're inclined not to care particularly.

 

[Leporello]

:yikes:

The stereo Four Last Songs with Szell is IMO one of the most ravishingly, overwhelmingly beautiful records of anything, ever, and would definitely be a Desert Island Disc of mine.

Seconded. Do you find Schwarzkopf's singing "artificial" and "mannered" as many others do? I do, but (in some perverse way) I like it. Art is Art.


Regards,

L.

 

[PeteH]

Seconded. Do you find Schwarzkopf's singing "artificial" and "mannered" as many others do? I do, but (in some perverse way) I like it.

I'm not really enough of a Schwarzkopf buff to have much of an opinion in general, but I'd say that on the current Strauss disc the songs are really brought to life - with very strong, almost operatic, expressive diction. If anything I'd probably describe it as 'characterful' rather than mannered.

 

[GrahamN]

The stereo Four Last Songs with Szell is IMO one of the most ravishingly, overwhelmingly beautiful records of anything, ever,..

I'm sorry, but that was the first recording I heard of these pieces, and I found it quite horrible, and subsequent hearings have done nothing to change that view. I then got the Janowitz recording, basically by accident, as the fillup for Tod und Verklaerung, and by the second hearing I'd completely fallen in love with the songs. I just don't like Schwarzkopf's voice - which has to me a very unattractive brittle edge to it. Similarly I don't like that famous Rosenkavalier recording. I do have one recording by her - Klemperer's Mahler 2. Fortunately the soprano has a very small part - but that mannered, artificial quality comes through in spades, and Heather Harper for Solti is just so much better (and Helen Watts also completely outclasses Roessl-Majdan). Also those high notes she sings for Flagstad in the Furtwangler also stand out like rather sore thumbs (even if Flagstad's voice is rather obviously past its prime)

Her voice may be a bit too heavy for the 4 Last Snogs though

A bit Freudian, methinks.

Hardly - have you seen her sing? She has such an enormous gob (well, everything really) I would strongly recommend no-one to venture in that direction without being well secured in a stout safety harness . Karneus on the other hand is a completely different proposition :shame:

(Disclaimer: No offence is intended by the above to Ms Brewer or any friends/relatives that may read this, but you have to admit she would have a rather short career as a supermodel )

 

[Coda II]

Thanks for all the above. On the Four Last I have to say I am still with Schwarzkopf, more about Norman in a minute.

PeteH

The only problem is she's recorded a bit too close, but the sound she produces is just so meltingly gorgeous that you're inclined not to care particularly.

(could someone explain the quote options available, using firefox ?)

Have you tried the LP against the CD ? I find the balance quite different but that may be my system.

Have only recently got the Norman recording and it's on second hand vinyl. I think the problem I have is not with the recording as such but the memory of Norman live. One of those live events that has burned itself into my mind was standing ten feet from Jessye Norman at a Proms performance of Das Lied von der Erde probably about twenty years ago now. The sheer scale and power of the voice (and the person) at that range is beyond comparison. I'm sure it is down to systems and expectation, but I have always been dissappointed by her recordings. Do you think I would get anywhere with a 'Systems that do justice to Jessye Norman' thread (honestly, suggestions welcome). I know this approach overlooks interpretation and all the other musical things that are there to enjoy, but it is a personal hurdle, and I don't have the problem to that extent with anyone else.
Part of the motive for my original question was a desire to pursue other repertoire rather than simply more Last Songs recordings.
GrahamN: Christine Schäfer I enjoy for what she does well, in the lighter Strauss songs - Morgen seems to be the one that all sopranos are compeled to include in recitals at the moment - her voice is delightful. As it is with some Mozart - has anyone heard her on the recent live Requiem (Abbado I think) ?
Karita Mattila - a wonderful voice, agree completely about her and Barbara Bonney in Arabella, Thomas Hampson was swaggeringly good as well. Have you heard Mattila's Grieg/Sibelius songs released this year ? A case for me of artist first; trust them with the repertoire and discover something wonderful and new (to me). She is doing Isolde in recital soon I think, with a full production when she thinks she is ready ! There was a R3 interview with her earlier this year where she said that on finally agreeing to perform some of the role she bought the Nilsen and Flagstadt recordings, put them on and then wondered what she had agreed to. At least she knows what she is aiming for. We will have to wait.
Alice Coote - yes would like to hear more, very enjoyable Orlando at Covent Garden.
Finally my other current vote would have to be for Waltraut Meier.

 

[alanbeeb]

I'll have to listen to the the Janowitz/Karajan again, I'll admit its been a while. As I remember it wasn't the singing that bothered me, but the way the music was being played. Will listen again and see what I think.

 

[Sir Galahad]

The stereo Four Last Songs with Szell is IMO one of the most ravishingly, overwhelmingly beautiful records of anything, ever, and would definitely be a Desert Island Disc of mine. .

I'll take your word for it and put it on my Xmas shopping list. I got (and love) Norman, but friends keep telling me I'm missing THE reference. So there.

 

[PeteH]

I'll take your word for it and put it on my Xmas shopping list.

Gosh. No pressure or anything - maybe it only sounds good on NAD systems?

Have you tried the LP against the CD ? I find the balance quite different but that may be my system.

I haven't I'm afraid, but then the CD isn't actually any worse than the vast majority of vocal and indeed concerto recordings in balance terms - the microphones are just a bit too close to the soloist so she's unnaturally projected against the orchestra, as is almost always the case when vocal or concertante recordings are made (or indeed when solo lines are picked out of the orchestral texture by an over-zealous balance engineer).

 

[alanbeeb]

I'll have to listen to the the Janowitz/Karajan again, I'll admit its been a while. As I remember it wasn't the singing that bothered me, but the way the music was being played. Will listen again and see what I think.

You know I said it would be the only one I'd consign to a 2nd-hand shop.... well, it looks like I already have. I cannot find it on the shelves, I might have let it go years ago, or given it to someone.

Anyway, listened to the other versions....
Norman/Masur - slow and heavy. But She has so much power in her voice.

Schwarzkopf/Szell - I am no judge of voices but I can tell her phrasing and breathing are not where they should be - but, it seems to have a lot of character and personal accent that is very individual and very appealing.

Studer/Sinopli - surprised no-one else has mentioned this one. Studer's singing sounds excellent to me (where is she now?), not dark toned but plenty of weight. Sinopli and Orchestra - Dresden Staatskapelle - will either delight or discomfit as you can hear every orchestral detail and texture of the magical score but maybe over-detailed and nit-picking.

Isokoski/Janowski - cannot fault the singing and probably the best accompaniment of all, again all the detail of score is there but without getting in the way. However, slightly light toned and not much weight to her voice. very nice but maybe a bit bland?

Overall, I would want to keep all of the last 3 above for all of the songs, and Norman/Masur for song no. 3 Beim Schlafengehen as her voice is still on full tilt and in flight when the words end, while the others are clearly winding down.

 

[Coda II]

I haven't I'm afraid, but then the CD isn't actually any worse than the vast majority of vocal and indeed concerto recordings in balance terms - the microphones are just a bit too close to the soloist so she's unnaturally projected against the orchestra, as is almost always the case when vocal or concertante recordings are made (or indeed when solo lines are picked out of the orchestral texture by an over-zealous balance engineer).

I understand what you are saying but would still suggest that, if you can, you have a listen to the original LP, if only to tell me it's my TT that needs attention. I get a much more integrated sound from the vinyl (not necessarily 'better' but certainly different).
Just to give a completely opposing example. The Pablo Casals Bach suites from the 30's. I have a vinyl transfer from the 50's and Pearls (excellent) re-mastered CD set from a few years ago. The CD sounds far more like I would expect vinyl to and the vinyl sounds like a CD plyed thro' portable speakers. I don't know how much re-mastering went on with the Schwarzkopf for the current CD except that the case says it is Abbey Road processed.

 

[Coda II]

Will be seeing Kirchschlager and Bonney again at the Barbican in Feb, but unfortunately not in Strauss.

Couple of reasons for revisiting this one:

Is the above the one on R3 this Sunday,"Mendelssohn, Schumann and Dvorak and others." (details) if so, anything particular to look out for?

Also, heard Bonney's recording of Four Last Songs recently. Piano only accompaniment which suits the scale of her voice very well. Once you get past your brain filling in the strings for you, the delicacy of the voice and piano really does bring something different, particularly in 3 & 4

 

[cocytus]

Lisa della Casa with Boehm is tops on my list with Janowitz/Karajan second. Schwarzkopf's singing is an acquired taste, you either love it or find it very mannered. I used to hang on to her every word in her EMI opera recordings when I first got started in classical music, now I can't stand her. Her 4LS is good, but in no way can it be considered definitive or the Last Word, sorry.