Wanted.......

Yes ...but I need to be careful so that I keep within the bounds of the rule of the form ....

but this particular cable is in a white sleeve with white heat shrink and a wbt like locking plug..profi I think ... I'm not building cables with bling appeal ! I hope I've got the sound right rather than a flashy jacket .....oddly even this cheap sleeving method costs more than the copper conductors !

I keep banging on about why the industry want you to only listen to copper cables ......often denigrating other conductor types

its down to margins ....you can turn a nice fat profit on copper ...to give you and idea approximately

if platinum cost =£100 then paladium cost 1/5 Pl = £20, gold is 1/10 Pa= £2, silver is 1/8 Au =25p, copper is 1/100 Ag =0.0025p for the same amount of conductor.

similarly with silver again an approximation

silver 925 = £100, Ag 4n = £300, ag 5n = £2400 Ag 6n = ????

remember this is a gross generalization as higher purities of copper will cost up to 10 to 20 times the standard copper price.

or if your paying £100 for the cable made of copper the build cost is about £10 of which 50p is plugs the conductors a fraction of a penny and the rest to make the flashy jacket and presentation box, production costs, advertising design etc......maybe and could be even less if you buying the cable by the km...

Which actually supports some contentions that what your paying for is the blingness rather than sound....though by a fluke of nature copper doesn't sound too bad !

There was a chappy on ebay selling 6n silver ic at £35 ...apart from the fact that 6n silver was figment of his imagination claimed it was a typo ! it would have meant that assuming it was 5n silver the conductor thickness would have need to be 0.001mm for him to make any profit ...doesn't seem very likely to me ..but I'm not falable...

the cables offered for test here, break down as follows

£4 rca plugs
£2 jackets
£0.05 conductors
£10 build time power design etc
£1 misc parts solder inert filler etc
£18 total approx with projected selling cost of £40-£50
subtract £4 p and p
therefore after tax and setup costs I might see about £12 profit..per cable sold

I've no problems with letting you know my margins as I feel honesty and transparency is the key to a good customer relationship....especially in the hifi cable business...

So if you were to build this as a Diy project to make one 0.75m cable it would cost about £200 to buy all the constituents in minimum order form ....or about £25 if you buy the parts from me [I'll still see about £10 profit]

bit of an odd answer why no pics !

 

there's NOTHING WRONG WITH MAKING PROFIT, in fact, I hope to make as much as possible on the stuff I'd like to sell.

My maths makes it £36 profit not £12, at least by the way I calculate profit for my own business.

Again, nothing wrong with that, but it looks like you're trying to minimize the fact it's a business - no need. Business is about profit, and that's not a criticism in any way.

 

£18 to make ..
£ 45 to sell minus 20% tax [makes the math simpler]
£18 minus setup and incidentals [£6]
£12....being the remainder assuming £45 being the sold price.

I'm calling setup and incidentals the cost of providing the space / tools test equipment etc...

The figures are from the business plan approved by my accountant ...so unless is math is as poor as mine ...theres no hope!

soak testing & listening to the first batch now.....

But at least that means everything else makes sense to you !

 

No.....I'm offering a cable at the price I'd pay for the level of performance it offers ....

I could sell one platalloy cable at £350 or ten copper isoToPiCs at £45 ......the returns are roughly the same

 

I can't see the point of breaking down all the costs and putting it down on the pulbic forum myself...

 

I agree. I also can't see why Pete takes offence to any suggestions that he's running a business or making a profit.

 

Did anyone get promised a cable for us to try blind at an impartial bake off? Ian? Rob? Dev? No?

 

I wasn't after a cable Mike. I'm just going to loan my CDP to Ian/Rob for the bake off.

 

those people who contacted fatkat quickly enough will have been asked for there details ....if not you missed out.

 

All the best with your new venture Pete.

 

cheers pal .....

remember the AgAu cables you have already will fall into the upgrade option [you just pay the difference between the current price and the cost of the new higher performance cable ....sort of a part exchange scheme]

 

aah, I'd assumed you'd be VAT registered and able to reclaim your purchase VAT, but if not that would explain.

If you intend to sell any quantity of these, I'd reccomend investigating becoming VAT registered.

 

So did Rob or Ian manage to get one for testing?

Rob? Ian?

 

Mine hasn't arrived yet. Early days, I suppose.

-- Ian

 

Following discussions over the weekend .....all those eligible will receive the following letter copy attached .....

I'm certain that you all understand why ....

This will of course add a few days onto this exercise but I'm afraid thats a consequence of certain peoples actions. I'm sorry that one person has spoiled things for the rest of you ...but thats life.

Dear,

Thank you for taking the time to respond to my request for cable testers.

The cables supplied are late prototypes and is not intend to represent the finalised commercial cable that may follow.
The object of the exercise is to find out if they suit a variety of personal tastes rather than “is the cable a bargain at its specific price point”. It would be useful to know what equipment the cable has been used with , and an indication of room size and furnishings would be helpful. It would be of use to know in rather more detail what the other cables in the system are. For instance if you were to say “these cables sound exactly the same as the ones I already use”….if I don’t know what your using the information is of little or no value. On the other hand if your using very exotic cables these cables will, as likely or not sound poor in comparison….and again a comment like “ these are S*ite…” will say more about the writer than of the cables !

Following a recent issue I have been advised by my backers that I need to obtain the permission in writing of possible participants. This will put everything back a few day so I must apologise for that .

Assuming your able to return the signed permission slip, I will be delighted to forward you the cable for test ASAP . Unfortunately if you can’t sign the agreement you will be unable to take part in this or future similar exercises…


All the very best

Fatkat


Pp



Your individual voucher code for this test is
IAMDF*****








The small print ….

To receive this cables this declaration should be signed and returned to the above address

I understand that ….

the information that I have provided will not be disclosed to anyone in accordance to the data protection act .

that the information I provide on these products will be private between myself and Fatkat Acoustics, and any disclosure to or by a third party will invalidate this agreement.

any attempt to tamper, interfere, damage, deface the item in anyway will mean that I have purchased the item at the full RRP.

That as a reward for taking part in this exercise I am entitled to 25% off any single future purchase. [Stating voucher code at time of purchase]

That the information provided as part of this test, may not be used as part of any advertising or sales campaign unless with prior agreement.

That the use of this item is at entirely my own risk, and that Fatkat Acoustics is not liable in anyway following the items use either correctly or incorrectly to myself or a third party.

If you feel you are unable the sign this agreement you will not be eligible for this test nor will you be considered in future tests.

I have read, understood and agree to the above statements and will abide by these as stated and implied.

Signed………………….
[if under 18 parents or guardian signiture]


date……………………..

Address ……………….



I've placed this here so everyone knows the situation and that theres nothing untoward going on. Everyone can see what the testers have agreed to and any rewards for such.

 

I think you've just brought the credibility of the whole exercise into question. IMO it would have been better to have no conditions attached (I don't know why anyone would want to "tamper, interfere, damage, deface the item in anyway" any cable but it is perhaps the only condition I'd attach) and let participants decide which cable if any they preferred. You've already gone on the defensive without a single test.

 

Indeed.

I read this as meaning that if I took part in the test I wouldn't be able to involve others in the test or report the results here. A shame. Can't say I'm surprised though.

-- Ian

 

This is how I read it too. Defeats the object of the exercise I think.

 

I have to say, this is the double edged sword of using a forum to help a new business start up.

You will have a wide open audience to a new product, and there will be no financial cost to that marketing. There will also be some positive praise.

The double edged side of the sword is you will also be open to any criticism that comes your way, whether it's something you'd personally agree with and want to see or not.


For what it's worth, I don't think you 'can' restrict both positive and negative comments. For example, as soon as a product is out there, it will be open for all and sundry to praise, criticise, tamper with, or whatever the new owner decides to do with it.

 

FWIW I consider it exceptionally unwise to even try. Either use a public forum to market test a product and learn from the members responses or don’t. This is not something one can half do IMO.

Tony.