buying high end - secondhand or new?

D

dominicT

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It appears that the residual values on high end gear is not good, even for sought after models. One must question the logic therefore of buying new, especially if one's budget is £15-20k!

The challenge will be being able to demo and to put a system together - something that a dealer of new goods can do easily; at this stage I do not know what products I want. I would not be keen on buying on other peoples preferences and taking a chance so it could be a drawn out process of trial and error with the resultant cost of potential mistakes on resale and time - which I have little of. It seems unfair to use a dealer to then buy on eBay unless you paid him/her a consultancy fee. Any thoughts? Thanks D
 
dominicT said:
It appears that the residual values on high end gear is not good, even for sought after models. One must question the logic therefore of buying new, especially if one's budget is £15-20k!

The challenge will be being able to demo and to put a system together - something that a dealer of new goods can do easily; at this stage I do not know what products I want. I would not be keen on buying on other peoples preferences and taking a chance so it could be a drawn out process of trial and error with the resultant cost of potential mistakes on resale and time - which I have little of. It seems unfair to use a dealer to then buy on eBay unless you paid him/her a consultancy fee. Any thoughts? Thanks D
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If your willing to travel you might find fellow enthusiasts on here who can demo their equipment. I think you need to at least be aware of what your roughly after. Maybe listing your music preferences, listening room size and budget would help.

I'm not sure if you meant 15-20k was your budget or not but if it is then you certainly have a lot of options and the world is pretty much your oyster if your spending that on second hand kit.

Have you heard anything recently that impressed you? That could be a good way to gauge what sort of direction to head in.

I notice the kit in your sig. What do you consider the weaknesses of this setup to be?
 
There is a huge choice, the market is flat and dealers are desperate to sell! I still would decide upon speakers first ,and then find suitable amps.
 
ShinOBIWAN said:
If your willing to travel you might find fellow enthusiasts on here who can demo their equipment. I think you need to at least be aware of what your roughly after. Maybe listing your music preferences, listening room size and budget would help.

I'm not sure if you meant 15-20k was your budget or not but if it is then you certainly have a lot of options and the world is pretty much your oyster if your spending that on second hand kit.

Have you heard anything recently that impressed you? That could be a good way to gauge what sort of direction to head in.

I notice the kit in your sig. What do you consider the weaknesses of this setup to be?
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Yes £15-20k is my budget. Please see my other thread called "£15k dac based system" for what I have liked so far.

The question on this thread is about whether buying new is a waste of money balanced against the seemingly impossible task of finding demo facilities for secondhand gear, that may or may not be simultaneously available, where one can listen to the products that one wants to compare.

At this level of expenditure system synergy is important to maximise the budget but how do you buy if you cannot audition properly. Is the answer to ask a number of dealers to all turn up at your house the same day?
 
Some dealers will bring stuff to your home. Drop Paul, (Hi Fi addict ), he will come around with gear, much better to hear equipment in your own home.
 
coops said:
Some dealers will bring stuff to your home. Drop Paul, (Hi Fi addict ), he will come around with gear, much better to hear equipment in your own home.
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I always have home demos, the point is that the majority of kit that I now want to listen to is available from probably about 6 different dealers. Is it reasonable to expect them all to turn up in the same day. If I was the dealer I would decline!
 
Dom it can be a bit of a logisitical nightmare,but I am certain some dealers would leave gear with you, have you thought any more about speakers? Hi Fi shows can be quite useful to hear a wide variety of stuff which you can follow up on, Keith.
 
coops said:
Dom it can be a bit of a logisitical nightmare,but I am certain some dealers would leave gear with you, have you thought any more about speakers? Hi Fi shows can be quite useful to hear a wide variety of stuff which you can follow up on, Keith.
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Hi Keith I am conscious that the majority of people on this forum who attend these shows say that the systems sound far worse than they would at home or in the dealers dem room. I would also want to play the music that I want to hear as I have some reference CDs that I know intimately. I am open to attending the Bristol show but not sure that I would get much from it apart from a brief glimpse into a sound. Naturally manufacturers will partner their gear with what they think from their own range and this seems to go against the advice from this forum where mixing and matching seems to be the way forward. The other problem judging by photos of these shows is that many manufacturers demo their gear on glass stands which I strongly dislike.

I have a busy life and really do not have much time to go from dealer to dealer. I really had anticipated spending no more than 4 days on finding the right system and have spent 1.5 already. I think that I will concentrate on a few dealers ie MoS, KJ, Analogue Seduction and maybe MAX and get them to come to me. You never know I might turn it into a bake-off and invite a few people along! Thanks for your help. D
 
Dominic,

As an alternative you could try second hand dealers who will also demonstrate gear. Most dealers have trade-in stock and Sounds of Music do some really high end gear so do have £15K 2nd hand stuff. I bought a pair of Tannoy TD12s from them for £3.5K. They demo'ed the speakers and were happy to let me hear a range of others (a lot second hand). He delivered them (60 miles) and I have a 'buy -back' deal. They are a little more than buying of e-bay but you do get some dealer support. The Hifi Trading Station are also good to deal with. Both allow you to swop if you are not happy when heard at home and they give a reasonably good return price later on (if you want it).
 
Thanks George I already know these people and they are great. The problem is finding what you want 2nd hand simulaneously so that you can demo it as a system before committing.

What I would be interested to know is how you guys have managed to build high end systems especially when buying 2nd hand. I have no interested in buying to try and selling on. I want to buy once and live with it.
 
Unless you know exactly what you want there IMHO are no shortcuts,It will take time,better to except it rather than blowing your £15K in a rushed few days of intense demoing and cursing for years afterwards.
with your budget and some considered and unrushed home demos you should end up with a stunning rig.I'm guessing it was you with Richard at SoM on yesterday ;then)
I have found they are very easy going regarding home demos
I never got the "vibe" that a quick decision was needed so get your preferd kit from them and take your time with pairing it up what ever way you go best of luck anyway Dom.
 
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Dominic I'd definitely recommend buying second hand. You'll potentially get much more for your money. The problem with that is you'll end up struggling to get home demo's or will have to travel to listen and collect. By the sounds of it you're not willing to invest much time in this. I guess what I'm saying is that it will be harder work than getting dealers round to your home but the reward will be a higher quality system pound for pound.

I don't think any well sorted 15-20K system, whether second hand or new, will have significant defects.

Alternatively hand me £15k and I'll build you a pair of unique one off active loudspeakers built to your specifications. :D It would be infinitely better than the commercial tat around that price point.
 
ShinOBIWAN said:
Alternatively hand me £15k and I'll build you a pair of unique one off active loudspeakers built to your specifications. :D It would be infinitely better than the commercial tat around that price point.
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Thats not actually a bad idea. In fact its so good I will offer to do the same! :D
 
coops said:
Do you have a website Shin?
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No website, don't need one. Anything I build is for myself.

As I said to Ya-Boo, I'd love £15k of someone else's money to see how crazy a DIY project could be. I think I'd do it for free so long as I got to listen to them. :)

For perspective I spent just under £4k building these:

tism166.jpg
 
Thanks guys for the thoughts. Yes it was me with Jamie and Richard on Saturday; did not realise that anyone else was there!

If I was to talk in car terms then things are very easy despite the number of manufacturers and its the same with clothes. At the high end it always comes down to a few manufacturers and decisions are easy depending on your criteria; much easier when you are familiar with the marketplace and with high-end hifi I am not.

BTW I am watching/listening to Roxy Music Live at the Apollo on an i-Mac using the built in speakers. It sounds great because the performance is great! So even though I am not prepared to search and search and search for a long time like some of you guys did/do, I want to make a purchase, enjoy it, and will not think twice that I might have been able to get something better - of course I could have, but life is too short to try to find the extra 5% of performance and then think about the next upgrade.

I will start another thread to give a very specific brief on what I want. I know exactly what I want, but as I say, do not know the marketplace. Thanks again. D
 

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