Hello! hifi room positioning & mains advice sought...

Hi chaps.. recognise some few old faces from HFC.. I used to post over there last year. Unfortunately since my system has been entirely boxed up for the past 5.5 months since buying a delapidated house in September, I've avoided surfing hifi forums in order to minimise the agony of not being able to listen to mine!

But today the carpet man is coming round to fit the finished hifi room. only trouble is it's a 100 year old house and I don't trust the mains (TV picture sometimes goes a bit funny when other appliances kick in..) so I'm after a 4 to 8 way mains block to run all the components off. Any recommendations? surge/spike protection built in would be good for my peace of mind; if you can recommend any which have a filter built in that would be even better. My list so far consists of...

Olsen Sounds Fantastic, IsoTek cleanline, Black Rhodium Super mains 25 or Supermains Power Management, Russ Andrews powerblock, Merlin Scorpion Main Black 4 way.

Budget about £300. if you think any of these will actually improve the sound I'm willing to try with open ears, but my main aim is really just protection for the components. A separate spur would be the best idea I guess but I don't think my wallet's willing to pay for that...! (what would be a ballpark figure for this, for outer london sparky prices..?)



The other question I have is pretty simple..

this is the layout of the room:

outside wall. 4m total length
._________................... __________
|..............|__________|.................|
|..................................................|
|..................................................|
|..................................................|
|..................................................| 3.4m (large
|..................................................| window and
|..................................................| curtains)
.\.................................................|
..\..door.........................................|
...\______________________________|


Just out of interest (and before I start experimenting!) what placement would you *expect* the system to sound its best?

2 main options would be,
Setup along the longest side: speakers in the alcoves either side of the fireplace,
or..
setup along the shortest side: speakers in front of the window/curtains facing the opposite wall.

N.b. the room has suspended wooden floors, with thick carpet (or will have after today) & a rug. In front of the fireplace is the old concrete+tiled hearth which I suspect would be a good place to have the rack. walls are newly emulsioned, but i plan to hang drapes/pictures/bookcases to break down some reflections.


Many thanks for your help....

 

for 300 notes you could get a dedicated spur fitted by a sparky
that would be my start point

 

Get a sparky to do a spur with a separate earth spike - much better value for money than all the overpriced Russ Andrews etc stuff.

 

seperate spike may not be possible, depends on existing earth arrangement

 

I'd go with the separate spur idea. If the house is old and the wiring suspect then a new run to your hifi sounds like a good idea. I've done this with my house and it works very well.

As for prices, my spur was a lot less than £300. More like about £100. I've got a mate who's a sparky though so that helped....

Here's mine



As for positioning, I have a similar room to yours and found that positioning the speakers either side of the fireplace was the best solution. You just have to be careful that the speakers are far enough out into the room so that the stereo imaging doesn't get messed up. Otherwise, you end up with two separate speakers and not a cohesive central image.

 

Thanks for the replies so far.

I'll certainly look into getting a separate spur. Thought it would cost more than that. What exactly do I ask the sparky to do - and how much work does it entail? The room is just newly decorated and the carpet's now in.. Also what's a seperate earth spike - how do I check my existing arrangement?

With a separate spur in place, are mains filters etc.. still needed ? woulnd't there still be interference caused by all the other houses down the street tapping into the same supply?

would you list me the exact spec and equipment I would need to request a quote for, since I don't really know what I'm talking about, and I'll go phone Mr Sparky directly!

Thanks,
Simon

 

spec + equipment

depends what you want
tell the sparky you want X amount of sockets, fitted near your system and supplied from a seperate spur, prefferably with its own consumer unit.

 

Basically a spur is a dedicated line striaght off your consumer unit (the box under the stairs!!) it's independant of the rest of the house and so should provide nice clean power.

Some will go for a one way electrical street to the plugs, others a new ring I reckon best to keep it simple and go for the former.

Also you might want to think about having a single unswitched socket or a number of sockets on the spur, the first would be used with a distribution block and may give better earthing I've heard..

Well something like that anyway.... it would have better to do this before putting in the carpet but should still be straightforward....

Cost me about 180 from a bod in yellow pages.....

 

Just had a look at the big white switch box in the cupboard downstairs (I presume this is the consumer unit!). I had this put in when we moved in and got an electrician round to do a safety check - basically it has fuzed switches for upstairs lights, downstairs lights, upstairs sockets, and downstairs sockets, so I can turn off just the upstairs sockets if I wish... hence, am I right in thinking then that the upstairs sockets are on their own 'spur' ? If so, then there's going to be practically nothing else plugged in up there except for maybe a lamp, so would a new spur still be worth it?

 

Yeah sod it why not eh!! You are right although the upstairs sockets will be on a ring not a spur if you see what I mean.

My wife plugged an uplighter with a dimmer into my spur (it also runs the AV) and I have been going mad for the last few weeks trying to work out why my hifi was humming!!! So for future and wife proofing, you may as well...

 

I had a spare slot on my consumer unit so my sparky mate just took a separate spur off that and ran it to the hifi sockets. He used armoured cable - can't remeber the term for it but it's pretty well shielded.

As for sockets, as you can see from the photo, I've used six metal MK unswitched sockets. This does away with the need for a distribution block (I used to have a RA Yello block which I flogged to help fund the new spur).

My guess is my mains weren't too bad in the first place so I've not felt the need to add any additional filtering. All I use is Eupen power leads.

 

cheers lads. Sparky coming round tonight to have a look - said it'll cost aroudn 100 pounds. But he'll have to lift up the carpet which was only laid yesterday.. D'OH!

I'll probably ask him to stick in some unswitched sockets. Will MK bogstandard ones suffice or do people recommend ones like Russ Andrews super-dooper chemical treated ones costing 25 quid? I'm guessing the former..

 

MK will be fine
metal clad if you want

 

Is it worth mentioning that I've just had fitted a dedicated consumer unit with nine separate spurs and found it a substantial improvement over a single spur..

No? Thought not. :SLEEP:

 

I agree Tom. Nevertheless, the first spur is the most important one - make sure its 10mm.

 

I agree with penance

MK unswitched are fine. I only used metal clad as I've hidden my sockets in a little cupboard under the hifi. If they're visible then placky ones may be more pleasing to the eye/swmbo.

 

Mr Sparky is booked in for next wednesday.. 100 quid for the job. Nice one chaps, I wouldn't have thought about doing this, thought it would have cost a lot more, so thanks. Scared about the new carpet having to be lifted though...

So what's best.... single socket and a mains distribution block - or a single faceplate with 3 unswitched sockets on it? Will either way really make any difference? I've currently asked him for a single faceplate with 3 unswitched sockets, so the amp dac & CD transport will each have their own socket.

Alex what measurement are you referring to to have 10mm for, & why is that important?

Maddog, I'll ask him about some kind of e/m shielding for the underfloor wiring, since it will most likely run under the speakers..

 

just a little point, a spur is a branch taken from the ring final circuit (ring main) olny 1 double or 1 single socket can be installed on each spur.
A socket circuit fed from the consumer unit on 1 cable is a radiul circuit.

 

Simon,

The 10mm refers to the twin and earth size - a sparks would normally opt for 2.5mm or 6mm at most and say something like 'its only a hi-fi not a large cooker'. This misses the point since what you're trying to do with 10mm is reduce impedence.

There is something of a debate just now between multiple spurs (ie a single spur for each piece of kit) and a single spur with a block or better still a hydra (a hydra is something you can make up yourself or is something provided by dealers such as Grahams which results in all your mains leads terminating in one plug). The argument seems to suggest that multiple spurs major on detail and dynamics whilst hydras major on 'groove' and 'flow'. Presently I'm on multiple spurs but have been hydra'd and will try that again soon just to see. Either way, both parties agreee that 10mm T&E is best!

What you're attempting to do is remove as many connections (ie plugs, sockets, blocks) as possible, again to reduce impedence. Many also dispense with fuses for the same reason - with RCBOs fitted this should have no safety implications but won't thrill an insurance company.

I've tried a few conditioners, some at length and IMO they range from complete crap to not very good. The Ben Duncans/Trichord/Modded Trichords are the best I've heard (they're all versions of the same thing) but on proper spurs they are not beneficial, again IMO but also in the opinion of anyone who's heard them at my place since the 10mm spurs were installed. If you're stuck with a ring main (as I am at home) then these conditioners do provide substantial benefits - including better picture quality for AV!

Alex

 

If you are interested I've been given a number of Word docs that cover why and how to install multiple spurs and all the variations. If you email me at alves @ activesbl . plus . com I'll happily pass them on to you.