Hi-fi Shows In The U.k.

[nando]

let's face the facts and fiction, those days of heathrow are long since gone, good memories still linger on when famylies used to attend in their hundreds and exivitors as well as manufacturers were all pleased to have such attendance and enjoyed being there with blood sweat and tears when they got the bill, never the less it was fantastic , the atmosphere was great, but now we are involved in a fictional world of a revival based on ego trips rather than enthusiasm and entertaining joe public to enjoy what i think is a beautifull hobby and a pleasure to have, but somehow along the way it sunk, wish that it never, i really do.
nando.

 

[Richard Dunn]

You really can't be serious Nando, those old days were so polluted by bullshit and politics, it is *far* better now. Not so many brainwashed nerds running around with Dire Straight records under their arms, and completely pre-conceived ideas and closed minds.

The industry has had a reality check, and is far better for it.

Scalford and the London Bake-Off Show could not have existed back then. Punters would not have had the balls to stand up to the magazines, the reviewers, the retailers, BADA, FBA, etc etc. The future is like the distant past, the Radio Shows, true enthusiasts who build things, mod things, know about music beyond plinkety plonk LP12 records, know about hi-fi beyond what Ivor and Julian told everyone. Good times are a'comin.

 

[nando]

yes richard, i understand what you are saying but the issue is as said in the trhead was was the atmosphere and lot's of people coming in to the show, fair enough as a manufacturer you want results via new dealers but what i think most important is to guide costomers to what you have made and introduse them to your product's more of them are novice to this hi-fi , but that does not mean that they will not go away and prosper their thought's onto buying what their hearts fell for to own and ejoyed, not only in the looks of the item's but on the pleasure of meeting the maker, that gives them a welcome should they wish to by their goods,

 

[sq225917]

Not sure it has anything to do with standing up the the magazines etc, it has everything to do with the greater opportunity afforded by the internet however.

 

[nando]

richard, tell you a sample of how right and wrong you are,as for me i ended up the lesser loooser, since the 70's i have sold celef loudspeakers, later to be re-named as pro-ac,while working for musical images in C.G. i sold over the years the south east record sales for their spkrs, having made a simple comment on their £25.000 spkrs , not malicious, they closed my a/c with an attitude of maligment wordiing OLE!

 

[nando]

Quote

Not sure it has anything to do with standing up the the magazines etc, it has everything to do with the greater opportunity afforded by the internet however.

SQ, DID YOU EVER ATTENDED THOSE MID 80'S SHOWS AT HEATHROW?

 

[nando]

Quote

You really can't be serious Nando, those old days were so polluted by bullshit and politics, it is *far* better now. Not so many brainwashed nerds running around with Dire Straight records under their arms, and completely pre-conceived ideas and closed minds.

The industry has had a reality check, and is far better for it.

Scalford and the London Bake-Off Show could not have existed back then. Punters would not have had the balls to stand up to the magazines, the reviewers, the retailers, BADA, FBA, etc etc. The future is like the distant past, the Radio Shows, true enthusiasts who build things, mod things, know about music beyond plinkety plonk LP12 records, know about hi-fi beyond what Ivor and Julian told everyone. Good times are a'comin.

i hope so richard, may be to late for me, but i hope so,

 

[Richard Dunn]

i hope so richard, may be to late for me, but i hope so,

It is never too late Nando, the industry will be smaller, leaner and more fun and less brainwashed. More *self* opinionated and educated. Win - win!

You just need to adapt Nando, that is what life is about.

 

[Tenson]

None the less, when it comes to running a business selling or making hi-fi, having fewer customers, brainwashed by magazines or not, makes life harder surely? I wish there were more people interested in good i-fi, even if they did tend to naively believe the mags.

 

[Richard Dunn]

None the less, when it comes to running a business selling or making hi-fi, having fewer customers, brainwashed by magazines or not, makes life harder surely? I wish there were more people interested in good i-fi, even if they did tend to naively believe the mags.

The future of this industry is going to be dominated by second hand sales, because there is so much of it around, and the number of people wanting it is going to decline back to its enthusiast base. Hi-fi is no longer a "must have".

So for the likes of you and I we have to adapt to that market, I think I already have. You have to give a price that will compete in that market which means the retailer bites the dust, or adapts to producing his own direct sell product, imports a product to direct sell, or focuses on the second hand market.

You are what I and Les at Avondale (who is one himself) affectionately call bodgers, skilled technicians who can mod and improve existing product and add value. But to follow that market you have to look at what is out there and work out bodges for it. Or do a Puresound for solid state type products, mod and sort out some of this cheap Chinese stuff and add value to it. To that you have second string to your bow, your speaker, now I haven't heard it but people who I trust the ear of have and they say it is very good. So focus on export distributors, and sell direct in the UK at a price that will compete in the market. Use the forums to get product out on loan and listened to, get some satisfied customers who will recommend you, but don't try to do an AVI as it just backfires. If its good and the price is right people will buy it.

BUT we all have to buckle down the hatches over the next couple of years as that will be the change time and change creates victims, and victims are created by lack of cashflow and high overheads. The (ex) Government just delayed the inevitable by two years by wasting money to prop up the economy (spin = quantitive easing, reality = printing money to devalue your existing money), nature will take its course, balance must happen, so if you are still here and making a living over the next couple of years you will be in a good position when we come out of it. You are also very lucky to have a wise financial head in Rob willing to help you, so listen.

 

[Fnuckle]

Interestingly, it's only the UK that suffers this audio ennui. Even the American market is more upbeat about audio - although our show attendees are about 10-30 years younger than in the US.

You should go to shows in Europe, Russia or the Far East. It's not all brochure collecting and soldering irons at dawn; people bring their own music, their kids, even wives, they make an event of the thing, the hi-fi is not a sad little pursuit for old men to cut themselves off from the rest of the family, it's as much a part of the family entertainment as playing music or playing games on the Wii. Even rival manufacturers pull together.

Audio is changing, yes. But if we cling to this drab backwards-looking introspective nonsense, it will change by leaving the UK well alone.

Personally, I don't want to live in a backwater.

 

[Purite Audio]

Completely agree Munich is a vibrant show, thousands of all ages attend. Perhaps if there wasonly ONE national audio show?
Keith.

 

[Wammer64]

I don't think it matters whether there's one show or many.. The sad fact (and I'll agree with Richard here) is that there is absolutely no appetite for new hifi in this country at the moment..
I know for a fact that there were several stands run by well established/respected companies that walked away from Whittlebury, without even one serious enquiry! Couple that with the cost, of say five figures, to exhibit, and there's no surprise that the show list is a lot shorter this year..
The UK punter has to accept that if he no longer has the appetite for new gear, then he can't have shows either. He will also have to accept that future access to good quality 2nd hand gear will become scarcer and more expensive..
Is that what the enthusiast really wants long-term ??

 

[Richard Dunn]

I don't think it matters whether there's one show or many.. The sad fact (and I'll agree with Richard here) is that there is absolutely no appetite for new hifi in this country at the moment..
I know for a fact that there were several stands run by well established/respected companies that walked away from Whittlebury, without even one serious enquiry! Couple that with the cost, of say five figures, to exhibit, and there's no surprise that the show list is a lot shorter this year..
The UK punter has to accept that if he no longer has the appetite for new gear, then he can't have shows either. He will also have to accept that future access to good quality 2nd hand gear will become scarcer and more expensive..
Is that what the enthusiast really wants long-term ??

The enthusiast wants the best sound he can get for the best price, be that second hand or new - simple. There are still rich people around who will stick in a full McIntosh or similar system especially for AV who don't care about the price, it is just more house jewelry, but can those people sustain an industry, not any more.

The enthusiast is coming to the obvious conclusion that he has been fleeced and ripped off for years, and seeing the price of Chinese product coming into the UK has shown this, and not just in Hi-Fi. So if you want to sell new gear and be in this market then you have to represent your customer and his wishes, and that means music and value - full stop!

 

[nando]

i totally agree richard, with a bit of icing on the cake, i think that most manufacturers over price their wares,

 

[sq225917]

I don't think it matters whether there's one show or many.. The sad fact (and I'll agree with Richard here) is that there is absolutely no appetite for new hifi in this country at the moment..
I know for a fact that there were several stands run by well established/respected companies that walked away from Whittlebury, without even one serious enquiry! Couple that with the cost, of say five figures, to exhibit, and there's no surprise that the show list is a lot shorter this year..

The UK punter has to accept that if he no longer has the appetite for new gear, then he can't have shows either. He will also have to accept that future access to good quality 2nd hand gear will become scarcer and more expensive..
Is that what the enthusiast really wants long-term ??

There were plenty of brands at Whittlebury who frankly had no right to be there for several reasons. There were many small and unproven brands there who had fallen under the wing of distributors who no doubt promised the earth and did SFA for them. Brands with unique product that might be saleable if they went direct with attendant sensible pricing.

Let's use the Omnimon speaker guy as an example. 7k for a new speaker that you can't actually demo anywhere. A speaker that was half that price the previous year, or thereabouts. What good does his distributor do him? he is stuck at point of entry to the market by having too high a price for an unproven product- and he'll never be able to move past that point with his current pricing.

Likewise there were brands there who really should have hired 'staff' to present their products for them. Just because you are the designer, guess what, it doesn't mean you are the best person to talk to the public. I actually went there looking to make a deck purchase decision- one manufacturer had turned me off his product within 30 seconds of opening his mouth.

The truth is that the price of entry for most hifi is simply too high for the uninitiated, and most brands have nothing even vaguely resembling a new customer outreach program as part of their marketing plans. Marketing for most company just means advertising they have no idea what is involved in brand building and customer relationship management.

First time buyers now buy PC-fi, that's the truth and unless hifi brands do something to sell into this space, as for example B&W have done with their online music sales and Zepplin products and Idocks then they'll all be out of jobs in a decade.

Hifi brands are living in the past, it's not up to us to support them, its up to them to design and make something we want and then sell it at a competitive price.

 

[nando]

it is of no wonder that the hi-fi industry has and always became their own source of scalating averice to and for them sefes, and ignored the new comers to what used to be a wonderfull hobby and passion to be involved in, but as people like reviwers and magazines got their claws onto the bandwagon rubbing their hands as their eyes were saped on pound notes and back handers and could not give a shit about consumers but pretend to be god's gifted gurus of the hi-fi industry, reps alike, it was down to a very few salesmen out there to give their loyal knowledge to the customer and advice while those up top did not give a toss so long as the tills kept on ringing, when they didn't ring high enough the salesman got a hefty ear ache, i have been there and i made most independant dealers well off but never ever got a reward from them, still i do not regreat those years as to me it was my enjoyment of music and hi-fi,i can see how as an example from history that rome was never defeated from without but from within,
nando.

 

[Tenson]

So for the likes of you and I we have to adapt to that market...

You method of direct sales works okay for less expensive items, however I tried that for the Kensai and my experience is that people are not willing to buy direct for expensive items, even if it is great value. The Kensai will be sold through dealers in the near future (I hope!) which means the price will be a little higher than it was, but it also means people can hear it and see it in shops which seems to be what they want at the higher end of the market.

 

[RobHolt]

No reason at all why you cannot ride two horses.
The lower value/smaller products are well suited to direct sales so that is a perfectly good method.

Higher end stuff is where people want to touch, feel and hear the product prior to purchase so the dealer option is still perfectly valid.

One company can do both - they aren't mutually exclusive.

 

[nando]

quote

No reason at all why you cannot ride two horses.
The lower value/smaller products are well suited to direct sales so that is a perfectly good method.

Higher end stuff is where people want to touch, feel and hear the product prior to purchase so the dealer option is still perfectly valid.

One company can do both - they aren't mutually exclusive.

is not that part of exibiting your items in the show so people can see feel the product although to judge it sonic in such poor room condition they will get a taste on what the product is capable of, in the view of the interested buyer may wish ,either their nearest dealer with a view in mind to have a home dem, question? how about cost to the customer to have an home dem, will he/or she pay? 99% think not.