Neighbour-friendly speaker positioning

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owl37400

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I'm trying to decide how to lay out a room in such a way that me playing music will disturb the neighbours as little as possible.

Either I put the speakers with their backs to the dividing wall, or I put the listening position there.

If the listening position is against the wall, then the speakers are obviously further away from the neighbours but then again the sound is aimed towards them. If the speakers are against the wall they are closer to the neighbours but the sound is aimed in the other direction.

I'm not sure how the amount of sound coming from the back of a speaker typically compares with that coming from the front.

Another thought is that I could put some kind of sound dampening material on the wall. If the speakers are against the wall, I'm thinking that I could just put quite a lot of stuff behind those specific positions whereas if they are on the other side of the room presumably any dampening material would really have to go over the whole surface of the wall.

What do people reckon?
 
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It makes no difference which side they fire at in terms of how that shared wall is energised, it may make a little difference as to how the floor transmits bass to them. If you really care put your speakers on something like Auralex speaker pads to isolate them from the floor that's about as good as you can be short of treating the shared wall.
 
owl37400 said:
I'm trying to decide how to lay out a room in such a way that me playing music will disturb the neighbours as little as possible.

Either I put the speakers with their backs to the dividing wall, or I put the listening position there.

If the listening position is against the wall, then the speakers are obviously further away from the neighbours but then again the sound is aimed towards them. If the speakers are against the wall they are closer to the neighbours but the sound is aimed in the other direction.

I'm not sure how the amount of sound coming from the back of a speaker typically compares with that coming from the front.

Another thought is that I could put some kind of sound dampening material on the wall. If the speakers are against the wall, I'm thinking that I could just put quite a lot of stuff behind those specific positions whereas if they are on the other side of the room presumably any dampening material would really have to go over the whole surface of the wall.

What do people reckon?
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I'm guessing that your biggest problem is going to be bass, which isn't as directional. I would say keep the speakers as far away as possible.
 
I appreciate that the lower frequencies are the most difficult to deal with but as it is only a 9" brick wall separating us, the rest will be an issue too. You can hear people talking through a wall like that, after all.
 
If speech is audible then there is nothing you can do. Music won't be any quieter and much of it will be in the registers that bleed through. The answer is headphones I am afraid. That or my ultimate solution which was a detached residence. Took me 20 years to get there!
I think I am right in saying that sound proofing in an already compromised building will have a limited effect.
 
I miss my detached house! Now in a 1930's semi and constantly watching for the neighbours going out :) To be fair I still play it at sensible levels without complaint but sometimes if I come upstairs to the toilet I'm surprised how much you can hear elsewhere in the house so wonder just how much next door hears?

I still have the detached house its just in the wrong place by 75 miles :(
 
So is the general feeling that basically it doesn't make any difference which way round I lay out my room?

I realise that there's a limit to what can be done given the wall construction etc but I find it hard to believe that the orientation/position of the speakers will have no impact whatsoever.
 
Why don't u get a mate round go to the neighbours tell them ur concerns which I'm sure they will appreciate, ring ur mate and get him to turn the volume up and listen from their house and see what's a reasonable level, do it in the evening so u know u can get away with a bit more in the day, that's what I did, equalled a happy neighbour! :)
 
danworth81 said:
Why don't u get a mate round go to the neighbours tell them ur concerns which I'm sure they will appreciate, ring ur mate and get him to turn the volume up and listen from their house and see what's a reasonable level, do it in the evening so u know u can get away with a bit more in the day, that's what I did, equalled a happy neighbour! :)
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Yes, I can do this of course - however, it wouldn't answer the question I'm asking, which is what speaker placement is going to annoy them least.
 
owl37400 said:
Yes, I can do this of course - however, it wouldn't answer the question I'm asking, which is what speaker placement is going to annoy them least.
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The only speaker placement to make an appreciable difference wil be near field listening which means volume levels can be kept down. Isolation and soundproofing will further improve matters but if you want room filling sound then there will be bleed through.
 
Option A would be ever so slightly better. Also as SQ says, put the speakers on an isolation material of some sort to reduce structurally propagated sound.

The next step would be to build another layer of wall.
 
owl37400 said:
So is the general feeling that basically it doesn't make any difference which way round I lay out my room?

I realise that there's a limit to what can be done given the wall construction etc but I find it hard to believe that the orientation/position of the speakers will have no impact whatsoever.
Click to expand...

Really, it doesn't.

Look at it as putting a certain amount of acoustic energy into a box (the room). A proportion of this will leak out through each of the 6 faces - it doesn't matter whether the energy at each boundary comes from the speaker 'firing at it' or from the reverberant field, at all.

The problem as noted is in the bass end. In the midrange and up even modest constructions give quite good transmission loss, but in the bass, esp below 100Hz, performance drops right off- maybe only 25-28dB or so loss through 215mm of brick at 63Hz. Thump thump thump is what the neighbour hears...

Improving this through independant linings can be done: but to make useful improvements both the detail and the workmanship quality of executing them is utterly crucial. I am currently occupied in one corner of a current project with ensuring a dental vacuum plant room (internal peak noise c. 94db(A) ) can live next door to treatment rooms where we have to hit NC 35, ie deliver 60dB loss. It's difficult, and expensive...

Andyoz, if he still posts here, is the guy to ask nicely...
 
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felix said:
Really, it doesn't.

Look at it as putting a certain amount of acoustic energy into a box (the room). A proportion of this will leak out through each of the 6 faces - it doesn't matter whether the energy at each boundary comes from the speaker 'firing at it' or from the reverberant field, at all.
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So... if I have a room that is 5m deep, and I put a speaker right next to the wall, pointing at it, and take a db reading on the other side of the wall, and then I move the speaker right across the room, still pointing at the same wall, and take another db reading, it will be exactly the same?

I do note your comments about the bass being the main problem and the importance of detail/workmanship when you are trying to make acoustic separation. Having been involved in some building projects where we had to comply with building regs requirements for acoustic separation I'm a bit familiar with some of this myself.
 
Pretty much. The problem is the bass end of the spectrum, and in the bass the radiation from a speaker is omnidirectional. The room is enclosed, so the free field fall-off with distance doesnt apply. You might measure a dB or so but sadly that really isn't significant at all. HTH
 
OK, well that's useful to know. Thanks.

It's kind of counter-intuitive though because I know that if I stand right next to a speaker in a nightclub or something it hurts my ears more than if I stand 5m away.
 
owl37400 said:
OK, well that's useful to know. Thanks.

It's kind of counter-intuitive though because I know that if I stand right next to a speaker in a nightclub or something it hurts my ears more than if I stand 5m away.
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That doesn't apply in the examples you give earlier though, because the speakers in the closer position are then facing the other way. Turning them through 180 degrees will also reduce levels significantly so effectively cancels out the fact the speakers are closer to the wall. The fact remains the problem will be in the bass which is what travels best through walls.

As for annoying people more or less, some years ago I had a solicitors letter written and dropped through my door complaining about loud rock music being played. It was from the old lady who lived below me. I am black and into my Reggae, soul and pop. The rock was being played by the guy in the flat above me and I had to break it to her that the £25 she'd paid for the letter was in vain. When I read through the letter I was already in compliance with what would be called 'reasonable behaviour' and I was mindful to turn it down/off after 10:30pm.
 
Cable Monkey said:
That doesn't apply in the examples you give earlier though, because the speakers in the closer position are then facing the other way. Turning them through 180 degrees will also reduce levels significantly so effectively cancels out the fact the speakers are closer to the wall.
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Hm, that kind of contradicts what others have said above.
 
Well it wasn't meant to be contradictory.:) I know what a dilemma it can be after 20 years of flat ownership. The biggest change for me was the move from mainly elderly neighbours with an inclination to complain about everything to mainly young neighbours who seemed more willing to accept the compromises of flat dwelling. The best advice is to find a way to listen at lower levels and 'near field' and headphones are your best options.
 
Even though I'm in a detached house away from other residences I have a similar issue but with housemates. I tried different speaker and sub positioning but didn't make much difference what so ever. Everything is already isolated with spikes which helps I think.

Thankfully I start work much earlier than my house-mates so get back late afternoon and have about 4 hours to myself.

The only issue is the wall between my room and the lounge is a bit thin, house-mates girlfriend complains she can't hear glee on the TV :D
 
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