new power amp

R

rockhopper

Joined
Aug 5, 2005
Messages
394
Reaction score
0
Hi everyone,

I used to have my stereo amp connected to my AV amp's outputs, in a way that I could simply switch from AV (5.1) to stereo via the stereo amp's input. In AV use I would simply use the AV amp's volume to control the whole speaker setup - I would just leave the stereo amp at about 10 o'clock.

I sold the stereo amp, and I am in the process of buying a new power amp as a replacement for the stereo amp. My long term goal is to have 3 power amps i.e. 1 for the fronts, 1 for the centre, and 1 for the rears.

My question is: How will the AV amp know whether I am using stereo or 5.1? Is it just a case of switching the AV amp to stereo mode? Will it still recognise my power amp rather than using the AV amp's power section? With the power amp connected, will the AV amp automatically concentrate on the processing side, leaving the power to the power amp?

Please help! Thanks
 
rockhopper

If your AV amp (or processor) has pre-outs for all channels available then it will automatically route the signals to the correct amplifier depending on which mode is selected (ie stereo will just drive front L-R pair, surround will drive all amps)

You obviously won't be using the amplifier part of your AV amp/receiver.

If you do not have pre-outs for all 5 channels you wish to drive then this configuration won't work.

You might want to upgrade your AV amp to a proper AV processor

Hope that helps

Mr Perceptive
 
BTW

it is likely that your stereo performance will not be as good as when through the dedicated amplifier unless you have a fairly upmarket processor so exepect a little performance loss

Mr Perceptive
 
what amp have you go now rockhopper..?

seems bizzarre that you have to adjust the volume on the stereo amp tho - thats one of the reasons I sold on the x80...(but it was a great little amp)

with my nad c350 - simply plug the amps together and use the av volume..no matter what the volume of the nad!

I just took delivery of a c270 yesterday and that talkes stereo performance to a new level...and thats before I think about bi-amping!
 
thanks for the replies.

The AV amp does have preouts for all 5 channels, so no problem there. Yes I am a bit concerned the stereo side may not be as good, but this will hopefully be upgraded by a seperate surround processor later on. Actually, would it be possible (as this is the easier option for me at the moment) to use a seperate stereo processor with the system? So it would be:

AV amp (to drive rears and centre)
power amp (to drive fronts)
pre-amp (to drive fronts)
surround processor - some time in the future
 
mr cat said:
what amp have you go now rockhopper..?

seems bizzarre that you have to adjust the volume on the stereo amp tho - thats one of the reasons I sold on the x80...(but it was a great little amp)
Click to expand...

no, as I said in my first post, and as I said previously, I do not have to adjust the stereo amp volume. I simply use the AV amp to control the volume (including the main channels).

I am buying an Exposure 2010 power amp.
 
rockhopper

If your AV amp has power amp inputs then this would work, otherwise you would be back to setting the volume control on the AV amp for the centre/rears and using the surround processor volume control to do the overall volume.

What kit do you actually own and whats your budget, maybe some suggestions could be made.

Mr perceptive
 
Hmm its all starting to confuse me now.

My kit:

Yamaha 640SE amp (RRP £400)
Exposure 2010 power amp (RRP £500)
Mordaunt-Short Avant 5.1 speakers
BK XLS200 active sub
 
rockhopper

You are at a difficult price point part of the the market. IMHO if you go ahead with several Exposure 2010's you will spend say £750, although these will make your Yamaha better (especially since your speakers are not the most effecient in the world - ie ave effeciency) whether you would be better considering an Arcam AVR300 and just replacing the lot. This would give you better stereo sound (for sure) and probably better AV sound too, and can be got for around £1100 (s/h £900)

You could consider an Acram AVR200 (s/h £350) plus an additional power amp, which again would give you a better overall package. Again replacing the Yamaha.

Personally I think that multiple power amps only really come into their own in a bigger system.

I think you need to think carefully about your objectives (AV and Stereo) and save up until you can do the whole lot in one go (or flex the credit card). IMHO lots of buget upgrades are not the way to go, though you do get plenty of boxes to play with. The same advice applies to mr cat as well as he seems to just tinker at the edges of his system with no real direction.

Just my 2p, please don't take it the wrong way!

Mr Perceptive
 
I think Mr Perceptive is living up to his name today rockhopper, (the bike?), lots more power amps on that yamaha amp will improve things but not, imo, more than changing it for a better overall amp. the arcam suggested and others like it will not only give you less boxes, leads etc but also be a far better starting point for the next steps of upgrades that will be on there way ;-)

so get a new amp, keep the exposure power amp and use it for 2 channel and when funds allow get more of the same for the centre and rears.
 
rockhopper said:
Hmm its all starting to confuse me now.

My kit:

Yamaha 640SE amp (RRP £400)
Exposure 2010 power amp (RRP £500)
Mordaunt-Short Avant 5.1 speakers
BK XLS200 active sub
Click to expand...

sorry to barge in - is that a new sub too..? - just throught you had a mordaunt one when I was there...

what do you think if it then..?
 
Mr Perceptive said:
rockhopper

You are at a difficult price point part of the the market. IMHO if you go ahead with several Exposure 2010's you will spend say £750, although these will make your Yamaha better (especially since your speakers are not the most effecient in the world - ie ave effeciency) whether you would be better considering an Arcam AVR300 and just replacing the lot. This would give you better stereo sound (for sure) and probably better AV sound too, and can be got for around £1100 (s/h £900)

You could consider an Acram AVR200 (s/h £350) plus an additional power amp, which again would give you a better overall package. Again replacing the Yamaha.

Personally I think that multiple power amps only really come into their own in a bigger system.

I think you need to think carefully about your objectives (AV and Stereo) and save up until you can do the whole lot in one go (or flex the credit card). IMHO lots of buget upgrades are not the way to go, though you do get plenty of boxes to play with. The same advice applies to mr cat as well as he seems to just tinker at the edges of his system with no real direction.

Just my 2p, please don't take it the wrong way!

Mr Perceptive
Click to expand...
Well, i've thought about this a lot before deciding to go down the seperate pre/power amp route. From what I have learned, AV amps are aimed at people who are primarily conecerned about how loud their action films/explosions are, and the majority dont really care too much about sound quality.

My main concern is sound quality, and I think by building my system with quality seperates, I can eventually achieve a setup which sounds great with music and films.

I'm sure the AVR300 is an excellent AV amp, but what you have to think about is that you are paying for a hell of a lot of functions/processing modes/connectivity etc which to be honest, most of which I dont really care about. And to fit all this in one box, you can hardly expect it to compete with seperates.

Another reason is that I certainly cant afford to splash out 1K in one go, and I quite like the idea of upgrading gradually. Also, if I buy 2nd hand gear, I shouldnt loose much money if/when I decided to change my system.

Eventually, I plan to go for a processor, something like a Rotel. I cant see an all-in-one AV receiver competing with this kind of setup.

Thanks for your opinion though.
 
mr cat said:
sorry to barge in - is that a new sub too..? - just throught you had a mordaunt one when I was there...

what do you think if it then..?
Click to expand...
No, I originally had the MS308 sub, but that was long before I moved.

I've had the BK for about 18 months, and never looked back. For £280 i'd almost bet my life theres nothing better. 1st rate build, looks and sound IMO
 
Philip King said:
I think Mr Perceptive is living up to his name today rockhopper, (the bike?), lots more power amps on that yamaha amp will improve things but not, imo, more than changing it for a better overall amp. the arcam suggested and others like it will not only give you less boxes, leads etc but also be a far better starting point for the next steps of upgrades that will be on there way ;-)

so get a new amp, keep the exposure power amp and use it for 2 channel and when funds allow get more of the same for the centre and rears.
Click to expand...
yeah, the bike.

I mentioned in another post the reasons I wouldnt want another integrated AV amp.
 
rockhopper

The Arcam gear is very good in two channel stereo. I would still suggest that you chopped the Yamaha in for something like an Arcam AVR200 (s/h £350), you can then choose to use it with an additional power amp for the front L-R or not. The Arcam is certainly not about loud effects and actually produces a very detailed sound in both stereo and for AV and it comfortably bettered the previous Yamaha that I had (DSP-E800)

In fact I got rid of the Arcam partly as my wife complained that there weren't not enough loud effects, "where have all the spaceships gone", but I understand that the AVR300 addresses this.

Although you may have thought about it long and hard, at this price point a good quality integrated will form the best system basis.

Find a local dealer, take your speakers in and have a demo of an Arcam AVR300 (in stereo and AV), then let your ears decide. Personally I reckon it will walk all over a Yamaha/Exposure set up. Just remember real quality kit doesn't plummet like a stone in value (look at the discounts for the Exposure and you'll know what I mean). If you want to continually upgrade to equipment that you really desire look for stuff with decent resale values.

I've played this game so I feel that I have a useful contribution to this thread, and by some careful buying and selling of audio gear on the side I've upgraded my system at effectively little outlay.

And the Rotel will all be about effects as well, for decent AV Processors that do stereo really well look to Meridian, Naim, Lexicon and the top end Arcam.

Mr Perceptive
 
Mr Perceptive said:
rockhopper

The Arcam gear is very good in two channel stereo. I would still suggest that you chopped the Yamaha in for something like an Arcam AVR200 (s/h £350), you can then choose to use it with an additional power amp for the front L-R or not. The Arcam is certainly not about loud effects and actually produces a very detailed sound in both stereo and for AV and it comfortably bettered the previous Yamaha that I had (DSP-E800)

In fact I got rid of the Arcam partly as my wife complained that there weren't not enough loud effects, "where have all the spaceships gone", but I understand that the AVR300 addresses this.

Although you may have thought about it long and hard, at this price point a good quality integrated will form the best system basis.

Find a local dealer, take your speakers in and have a demo of an Arcam AVR300 (in stereo and AV), then let your ears decide. Personally I reckon it will walk all over a Yamaha/Exposure set up. Just remember real quality kit doesn't plummet like a stone in value (look at the discounts for the Exposure and you'll know what I mean). If you want to continually upgrade to equipment that you really desire look for stuff with decent resale values.

I've played this game so I feel that I have a useful contribution to this thread, and by some careful buying and selling of audio gear on the side I've upgraded my system at effectively little outlay.

And the Rotel will all be about effects as well, for decent AV Processors that do stereo really well look to Meridian, Naim, Lexicon and the top end Arcam.

Mr Perceptive
Click to expand...
So are you saying the power amp section of the AVR200 would outperform the power of the Exposure 2010? Or are you saying the processing ability of the Arcam is far better than the Yamaha?

I can see the processing being better than the Yamaha, but I very much doubt the power amps in the Arcam would be in the same league as the exposures.

I wont be looking at processors from the names you mentioned - as I said earlier, I am limited to what I can spend.
 
rockhopper

You need to look at the overall package, the AVR200 I reckon will wipe the floor with the Yamaha/Exposure combo as it is a balanced package. Sure the power amp may not be as good but the pre-amp part will definitely be better. In AV mode there may not be much in it, but the Arcam will win in stereo by a mile.

System Balance is the key.

The processors I mentioned are not out of your league if you buy and sell kit carefully. As I said I buy the odd piece of kit to sell it on (hopefully at a profit) and this funds my system. My wife is happy that I can change anything as long as it doesn't cost anything.

I posted this on another forum but it shows you waht is possible by thinking sideways (OK my system upgrade budget was higher than yours at £2k, but....)

From another forum:-
I personally prefer the s/h - ex-dem route and by buying carefully (as I think I have done) you can end up with a stonking system that retails way above your budget for on the budget money.

10 months ago I had a Yamaha DSP-E800 on the back of a old chrome bumper 1989 Naim Pre/Power/PSU (62/140/SNAPS). I chopped the whole lot in for a s/h AVR200. The Naims which cost me £800 in 1988 I sold for £500 and I got £120 for the Yamaha, the AVR200 cost me £360, so I was already up by £260. Incidently the AVR200 was subsequently on eBay and I fetched £380 (thus putting £640 in my new system fund).

I then bought a whole house audio system off eBay (£1550) comprising of 3 x pair of Quad 11L, 1 x 22L, 1 x Arcam A80, 3 x Rotel RA-02, 5 x Turtlebeach Audiotrons. My original plan was to use the 22Ls and 11Ls in my system, but I preferred my existing Shahinian speakers, all I have left now are the Quad 22Ls (being used as rears) - sold the rest on eBay/privately and I'm £700 up on the deal. So my kitty now has £1340. This together with a 2K budget gives me £3340 so by buying a Meridian 568.2 MM(£2K)+ 2 x 557's (£650 each) I've spent £40 under budget and I have a great system for a 2K outlay plus my old system!!!.
Click to expand...

So it can be done, but you won't do it playing with Yamaha/Exposure kit!

Hope it all works out for you, but you've certainly go something to think about now - think outside the box, not the latest super-fi deal!

Mr Perceptive
 
may i suggest selling the lot - getting a propper 2 channel rig and a cheap as chips richer sounds special a/v in a box system. i did this and am far happier with the results than with a compromised single system.
cheers


julian.
 
Its a suggestion Julian, but I have a family and AV is just as important as stereo. I don't believe my system is two channel compromised (the Meridian 568.2MM is a very effective DAC!) and having heard some very expensive two channel rigs in the last 3 months (WM and GaryG)

Each to their own

Mr Perceptive
 
Mr Perceptive said:
(OK my system upgrade budget was higher than yours at £2k, but....)
Click to expand...
This just about says it all Mr Perceptive - i'm talking about upgrading gradually i.e. spending a couple of hundred quid every few months for a while.

For a couple of hundred quid, I am not likely to buy a full system consisting of many speakers, amp etc, then sell to make a big profit...

For the amount I am spending, I think the Exposure power amps are an excellent improvement to my setup - these things retail at £500 each and I have acquired one for £190. I dont think i'm doing too badly, do you?
 

Latest posts

Back
Top