of the Naim faith, NAP 140 anyone?

Hi all,

I reckon many of the guys here at some point in the audio journey, (or still?) have used (using) Naim gear and are quite fond of them , anyone used a NAP140 and some other pre combo (be it the 32, 42, 42.5) before? Any comments on them? I did have a chance to recently listen to a 42.5 + 140 setup and am quite impressed with what these shoeboxes put out!

Alas, it was by-chance and not a dedicated listening/audition session per se, what more I did not do an AB to be sure thoroughly about these, but all in all for what they are, considering their age also, I am impressed!

Getting hit by a case of GAS (gear acquisition syndrome) and having an itch to scratch, anyone had experience with these units before? Rated at a conservative 45 wpc at 8 ohms, decent enough, but quit with the technicalities, I have to say in that short hour I liked what I heard, anyone care to help?

Relative newbie to all this, at this point in time my priorities are: an all-rounder with transparent mids and highs, good breadth and depth, and reasonable imaging?


Regards,
Kenny

 

Hi Kenny

Good to see/hear you here. The 140 is my fav Naim amp. A lot of folks will disagree with me of course but I find it the sweetest of the lot. OK, it doesn't have the power and slam, that's if Naim amps have got that , but it sounds really nice. I still use mine with my headphones (AKG K1000) but even driving things like smaller bookshelfs, the 140 is great. As for the preamp.... get something other than a Naim pre.

 

Hello robM,

thanks for your input also! Really, doing some internet searches I find the 140 to be quite popular and most reviews professional or not, point out that it can drive anything, but not a worry for me as I'm just using mid-sized bookshelves, I ought to probably go take a closer listen again this weekend perhaps;

Why do you not recommend a Naim pre? ok this is superficial but I'm just liking their design--a pre and power combo, both in the same form factor; I noticed though these shoe-box pre's from Naim (1) uses DIN connectors, a small issue, but (2) only 3! or some even 2 (excluding phono) inputs, that would take some getting used to, my main 3 sources are a CDP, my laptop and an FM tuner deck


cheers,
Kenny

 

Hi Kenny

Believe me...the 140 cannot drive anything but what it can drive does a great job doing it. If it's a bookshelf speaker it's an ideal partner. It's only a small amplifier that struggled with my Acoustic Energy AE1s at the time.

The 140 outclasses the 32.5 and 72. The cosmetics are nice though, and if you are good with a soldering iron then a 32.5 or 72 can be made to sound really good. There are places on the web that show how to get the best out of a 32.5/72 for nothing much at all.

 

In what way?
The 32.5 and 72 were the matching partners for cb and olive 140's in their day.

 

Hi muzzer

just because they were matching partners means nothing. A bit like saying the best way to get the best out of a Naim CD player is to use their own pre/power and speakers!

I have found over the years that using a 140 with a good preamp sounds better than using a 32.5 or 72 with a better poweramp than the 140. I've always found the 32.5/72 to be the limiting factor in the system. Most DIYers seem to spend a lot of time 'improving' the 32.5/72 but not the power amps. I had a 32.5/140 years back and tried all sorts of combinations to upgrade the sound. The 32.5/72 was definitely at fault, then I found out by that the Naim bandwidth is 'controlled' by the preamps. Most if not all other preamps out there try and allow signals through with amplification. Naim seem to tailor the sound with their preamps before passing this to the poweramps.

I know I'll get killed because of this observation BUT I've tried it and came to the conclusion by my findings.

 

Hi robM,

any thoughts on the similar-looking 42/90 combo? Are they in line with the 72/140 or a different thing altogether?

regards,
Kenny

 

Don't bother with the 90. The output stage is only good for very small 'cheapie' speakers. The 140 uses similar output devices to the 250. The 42 is again a pointless exercise.

If I were you, I would aim to get a 72/140. Change the umbilical cord and get both re-wired....to start. The signal handling wires in the snaic are really cr*p, and the internal wires in both the 72 and 140 are pretty much the same. Just changing these bits WILL bring about huge gains in clarity.

 

Kenny
May I suggest you ask the question on the pfm forum, there are a lot of Naim owners and modders there who will give you good advice.

 

Muzzer

Is pinkfish a Naimie forum?

 

It used to be a flat earth type forum years ago but its a broader church these days, but there are still a lot of Naim users there who don't like the Gestapo tactics of the official Naim forum. It has a very good diy section with lots of info on modding early Naim gear.

 

That was MY experince.

 

in simple terms only please:

flat earth means what exactly? and what on earth is the opposite - round earth?

 

During the 80's there was the Linn/Naim flat earth camp who championed the "tune" over anything else, ie does it make your toe tap, then there was the so called round earth camp who think more in hifi terms such as soundstage,transparency etc these were associated with valves at the time.
At the end of the day it's mostly bollocks, it's what sounds good to your own ears that matters.

 

what pr*t came up with that? That is the funniest thing I've heard in years!

 

Some P.R.A.T. of a journalist probably.

 

Naim subscribe to the view that amplifiers should be bandwidth limited by design, so that output falls away outside of the usual 20hz-20khz limits. The limiting is done via the pre amplifier circuits with the power amplifiers left open at high frequencies.

Care should be exercised if driving any Naim power amplifier where no filtering is applied. HF noise can cause instability, especially where Naim speaker cable or electrical equivalents are not used.

They work best paired with their own matching pre amplifiers which not only define the correct operating conditions for the entire amplifier system but are perfectly fine in terms of performance.

 

So why is it the 140 sounded A LOT better used with another preamp? As for 'care must be taken'.... never had a problem. I still use my 140 as a headphone amp for my AKG K1000s and that is running out of my LAMM tape out through a passive switched volume pot.

You can mix and match with Naim stuff but they don't want you to do it.

 

You might well think it sounds better - many others, myself included do not.

Presumably if the OP doesn't take care with matching he can send the bill for his blown NAP140 to you for payment?

I've heard a NAP160 driven by a CD player via a passive pot become unstable - it can happen for very obvious reasons associated with the Naim circuit. Go check the schematic.

 

Robholt -

You must be a Naim Audio dealer or something
After my NAP140 which I still use, I used a 250 and a pair of 135s all with a non-Naim preamp. Never had a problem. I still know a few guys today using a similar setup.