god strikes again

An ancient Jewish law which became obsolete 2000 years ago. Not even Israel follows that law today.
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You rather miss the point. Islamists follow that law as of today.

(Anyway, if it was obsolete 2000 years ago why has it been in the Bible for rather less than 2000 years?)

Paul
 
The Devil said:
It's hard to know where to start with this one!

First, animal rights aren't comparable with human rights. Second, human rights activists don't advocate summary execution for alleged adultery.

I don't think religion brought much in the way of "comfort" to this couple, David.
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Hmmmm - sounds like you didn't understand the point I was making.

It is irrelevant which 'cause' I chose to illustrate. The point was simply that people did this, not God.

I further added the 'causes' to illustrate that often people can be driven by something that you may agree with, but they go about it in a way you don't agree with.

So in this case, adultery .... I think fair to assume that many of us here would want our chosen partner to remain monogamous if we had entered into a contract of 'forgoing all others' - so that being the case, we would agree Adultary is undesirable/wrong. However that does not mean we think adulterers should be killed.
Therefore we would then be fair in assuming that most of us then would agree with the cause but disagree the actions.

So - those committing actions wrong - nothing to do with God.

Actually, I am not religious but I am fully open to other people having other views and I would not insult them or ridicule them for it. We could have debates which can be interesting and enlightening - it can be good soup for the soul hearing alternative viewpoints.
I think it has been made clear what your views on religion are, I really don't see the need to keep reiterating over and over. It serves no purpose this baiting and IMO risks spoiling the atmosphere.
 
Paul Ranson said:
You rather miss the point. Islamists follow that law as of today.

(Anyway, if it was obsolete 2000 years ago why has it been in the Bible for rather less than 2000 years?)

Paul
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Islamists follow the Bible but with caveats that allow them to choose what to follow and what to ignore. Most Muslims I have spoken to tend not to view the Bible as something to be followed (although the Koran says thay should).

Fragments of Hebrew manuscripts of the Ten Commandments have been found dating to 2nd or 1st century BC (just over 2000 years), and it is known that the Hebrew Bible was translated into Greek about 270 BC in Alexandria (Septuagint version). This would have undoubtedly have included the Mosaic Law, as it was translated for Greek-speaking Jews.
 
Dev said:
You really believe all this, don't you?
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I asked the question as to how a deleted post was quoted. There is only one way I know how this could have happened. As far as I am concerned to much time went by after I deleted it for James use of it to be explained otherwise. If he had posted it while it was still up fair enough but it wasn't. As usual no info was forth coming.....
LOL
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does not cut it as an explanation.

I've lost count of the number of times you've accused us of bias and being his "cronies",[/QUOTE]

Actually, I never named who James cronies are... I don't agree with the lack of moderation in regard to James activity on ZG, so this appears to me and a few other members of ZG to prove a bias in his favour....just an opinion with plenty of evidence to back it up. Please prove me wrong......

but in our opinion The Devil confronted you fairly a number of times and you are the one who threw a hissy fit. He is an athiest and entitled to express his disbelief in God just as you are entitled to believe in him.
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If you think its okay to bully some one of a forum, who has done nothing wrong other than be a little foolish thinking a fair and balanced debate could take place with James....So its okay to totally offend someone and their beliefs during such a debate, to be rude and bullying.....

He's probably received more abuse than he's given.
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I think thats a ridiculous statement to make, but you are entitled to your opinion on James behaviour. Several thousand posts and mostly the same in content. He is like a CD stuck in repeat mode.

Also can I remind you how the member (not mods) here voted when asked how best to deal with cable debates.
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I think there may be some here who think I want James sent off...No I don't, but I do think it right and fair for him to debate with no more unfounded sweeping statements, pontificating about things he knows nothing about nor has he tried. His almost total lack of qualification to back his posts up and his general behaviour cheapens the ZG community and ruins its spirit. His attempts at badger batting and bullying do deserve moderation....

This posts sole intention was to antagonize those of faith, no more no less. This says a lot about you James. Was it presented in a balanced way....NO. Not all Muslims would agree with the activity of the TALABAN, and would be as horrified as we all are by such things. Anyway James as a member of the Atheist/Audio Talaban yourself....I would be very concerned by your views, and how far you would take them if allowed....

I don't think you and I Dev will agree on anything, but I felt it important to offer clarification to my views....

DL


PS the access to my Avatar setting proves my point a bit doesn't it. Members take note.
 
penance said:
DL, I have no idea what you are on about.

There is a very easy explanation for the devil having quoted your deleted post. Please read my previous post and consider it.
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Thats all well and good but posting Avatars is something only I should be able to do.

DL
 
Seeker_UK said:
If you read the bible, you will also come across the Ten Commandments. Regardless of their real source, they are the 10 basic rules from which all other rules in Christianity and Judaism were created. The first commandment and therefore, arguably the main rule of christianity and judaism was "thou shalt not kill" which is, you must agree, a pretty sound rule to live by.
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Actually, the kill commandment is number five. The first three are rather pompous statements about god & the sabbath, the fourth is "honour your father and mother", which, given the way some parents behave, is debatable at best.

Then come four pretty obvious ones, which any decent atheist would agree with: you shall not kill, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not bear false witness against your neighbour.

Finally, there are two about "coveting" wives and speedboats, which seem pretty perverse, as humans covet other attractive humans, and love gadgets.

Seeker_UK said:
You are showing a bit of inconsistency here:

On one hand:

Someone has a distorted view of medical ethics. They commit atrocities in what they consider to be the name of medicine and justifiable within their distorted perception of what is right and wrong. But ignore them; medicine is good because the key tenet is good.


But then on the other:

Someone has a distorted view of religion. They commit atrocities in what they consider to be the name of religion and justifiable within their distorted perception of what is right and wrong. Ignore the fact that the key tenet is good, focus on the people who misinterpret religion.
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There's no inconsistency at all. Mengele, Shipman et al. carried out practices which are diametrically opposed to medical ethics.

The murderous Taliban carried out practices which are wholly consistent with what is written in their "holy" old book.
 
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Czechchris said:
Islamists follow the Bible but with caveats that allow them to choose what to follow and what to ignore. Most Muslims I have spoken to tend not to view the Bible as something to be followed (although the Koran says thay should).
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So, it's a pick-'n-mix religion, like modern christianity? I thought the holy book was supposed to be the word of god, set down to be followed to the letter by the faithful?

If you truly believe in god, and think that the bible is the cornerstone of a morally-correct life, then it's ridiculous to declare that some of the old biblical laws (of your choosing) have become obsolete in the modern world.
 
The Devil said:
So, it's a pick-'n-mix religion, like modern christianity? I thought the holy book was supposed to be the word of god, set down to be followed to the letter by the faithful?

If you truly believe in god, and think that the bible is the cornerstone of a morally-correct life, then it's ridiculous to declare that some of the old biblical laws (of your choosing) have become obsolete in the modern world.
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For Muslims, the Koran (and the Bible) are supposed to be literally the spoken word of God and meant to be followed to the letter.
If that is really what you thought was the case with Christianity, then I hope you now realize that you were in error. An understanding of the Bible and its history and teachings would clarify the situation.

The Bible makes plain that the Mosaic Law was for the Jews and Jewish proselytes only, not for all mankind, and was to lead them to the Messiah. When Jesus died, the Law covenant mediated by Moses came to an end.

If you would like me to refer you to the Bible texts in support of these points, I am quite happy to do so, either by PM or here.
 
Islamists follow the Bible but with caveats that allow them to choose what to follow and what to ignore. Most Muslims I have spoken to tend not to view the Bible as something to be followed (although the Koran says thay should).
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It's nothing to do with the Bible and everything to do with Hadith, Jewish law, Mohammed and some adulterers.

Christian hypocrisy is for another thread.

Paul
 
Czechchris said:
For Muslims, the Koran (and the Bible) are supposed to be literally the spoken word of God and meant to be followed to the letter.
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So, since all the many religious faiths which are currently popular are to be "respected", it follows that it's quite all right for these people to murder alleged adulterers, because their religion says they must?

Czechchris said:
If that is really what you thought was the case with Christianity, then I hope you now realize that you were in error. An understanding of the Bible and its history and teachings would clarify the situation.

The Bible makes plain that the Mosaic Law was for the Jews and Jewish proselytes only, not for all mankind, and was to lead them to the Messiah. When Jesus died, the Law covenant mediated by Moses came to an end.

If you would like me to refer you to the Bible texts in support of these points, I am quite happy to do so, either by PM or here.
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I understand the bible very well. It's a mass of contradictions made up from discordant documents. It makes absolutely nothing plain, and raises more questions than it answers. It is logically impossible to accept all parts of it as true. The whole thing is a transparent fraud.

Explain how many children Mary gave birth to, for starters.
 
the flashback mammoth looks like it's having fun with the people, it knows well enough how to lead the mass's it see's, just do the walk from satchel to sac,stay in line with those that shuffle to the sound of cogs,ding-dong, blood sweat and tears in the name of plenty, tempts with the smell, the grinding bones, the pleasure between the legs of mother worm that drips another puss fat corpse into the land of noise, and theres the clock, it's ticking to wake it's needle of desire,duty calls, lets infect the vein of circles and suck the next tomorrow where all is dry and sick from years of padded hell, plenty later for those that greave,but dont teach them there's a breath of infinity, better them to be silent among the fairground of bumping heads, feeding on mutterings at the lost junction of yesterdays never took, just those that wait for light to worry about, their spitting into the oil filled ears of death, holy shit. :)

:mo:
 
the flashback mammoth looks like it's having fun with the people, it knows well enough how to lead the mass's it see's, just do the walk from satchel to sac,stay in line with those that shuffle to the sound of cogs,ding-dong, blood sweat and tears in the name of plenty, tempts with the smell, the grinding bones, the pleasure between the legs of mother worm that drips another puss fat corpse into the land of noise, and theres the clock, it's ticking to wake it's needle of desire,duty calls, lets infect the vein of circles and suck the next tomorrow where all is dry and sick from years of padded hell, plenty later for those that greave,but dont teach them there's a breath of infinity, better them to be silent among the fairground of bumping heads, feeding on mutterings at the lost junction of yesterdays never took, just those that wait for light to worry about, their spitting into the oil filled ears of death, holy shit.
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Never drink and post.
 

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