Why do you visit audio forums?

Rob,

... so we need a forum to help do exactly that
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OK, here's my problem — since getting the Tannoys and Stingray, I don't have a problem.* ;-)

Joe

* Actually, the real eye opener were the cans, as they have less distortion than most amps.

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Joe Petrik said:
Rob,

I'm struggling to get a sense what zerogain is about. How would you describe it?

Joe
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A forum is what its members make it i.e. a community. An owner can try to steer or control the pack but as others have said it is a bit like trying to herd cats.
 
Richard Dunn said:
A forum is what its members make it i.e. a community. An owner can try to steer or control the pack but as others have said it is a bit like trying to herd cats.
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Steer is the operative word IMO.
You cannot ban or make certain views off topic as that simply kills discussion.

Different forums do have their own flavour though.
 
Well, this was the second and one of only three that I am a member of. I joined initially to try and find out more about my speakers (and a possible change) only to recieve unexpected but fundamental advice. I subsequently changed my amp and still have the speakers!

There was a thread which really turned me off and I stopped looking for several months. I also have the impression with ZG that if you are asking very basic questions, you will be lucky to get a response, suggesting things are on a higher level here than other fora. As a result, I have assumed this is probably not the right spot for me!

I still look every day, just in case something catches my eye but whereas I do enjoy listening to music that is faithfully reproduced, my primary interest is sailing, so I am never going to get into shows and bake-offs!

Sounds a bit like a 'Dear John' but therein lies a problem with any written submission - you can't read my face, intonation, body language or such other nuances that help us to communicate without falling out! Don't worry - I'll still let you know my favourite ale, even if I am a lightweight when it comes to the digital vs. analogue arguement!

Happy listening!

Andrew
 
Richard,

A forum is what its members make it i.e. a community. An owner can try to steer or control the pack but as others have said it is a bit like trying to herd cats.
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I realize that, but I asked Rob because zerogain has changed.

Although I've been posting here for only a few months (my membership dates back a bit further, though), the forum seemed to be very much a subjectivist love-in when I joined.

Obviously, not so much now.

Joe
 
Joe Petrik said:
Richard,


I realize that, but I asked Rob because zerogain has changed.

Although I've been posting here for only a few months (my membership dates back a bit further, though), the forum seemed to be very much a subjectivist love-in when I joined.

Obviously, not so much now.

Joe
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I really do not understand the problem nor have I ever understood it, it is just so much nonsense. Music is subjective, always has been and always will be.

In order to choose and enjoy an egg do you have to know how to run an egg farm or what to feed the chickens NO of course you don't, you only need your senses and mostly taste buds to make choices. So why do you lot want to try to be chicken farmers :rolleyes:
 
Richard,

I'm just saying that zerogain is different now from when I first joined. It's an observation, much like my observation that season one of Star Trek is better than season three. (I blame Spock's Brain for that, but the third season had several weak episodes.)

I have no interest in becoming a chicken farmer, but I do have an interest in -- going with the analogy -- understanding why eggs from free-range chickens taste better, an issue completely separate from the fact that that's the way chickens should be kept if they're to be kept at all.

Joe
 
The only real problem I have with these forums is when an individual tries to tell me what I can or can't hear as if what I'm experiencing is an "illusion." Frankly, I don't care if it's an "illusion" because it is part of my reality and I can't change it.

The "illusion" will be there tomorrow, the next day and ten years from now so I must accommodate it in my life. I absolutely refuse to drive myself crazy denying what I hear to fit some scientist's observation be they right or wrong.
 
Joe
So you want the understanding after the choice, purely an intellectual process that has no baring on your original choice. I am querying the desire to have the understanding before the choice - as Spock would say "illogical" as you haven't experienced what you are trying to understand so what are you attempting to quantify.
 
Richard,

I'm curious by nature -- I like to understand why things are the way they are.

Joe
 
oh dear, the thought of real "ale" conversation has turned bitter yet again, i am going to relax and listen to my lovelly tannoys, bless you all, p.s. infaltration of aliens have arrived to ZG, but not all are from mars,
 
Joe Petrik said:
Richard,

I'm curious by nature -- I like to understand why things are the way they are.

Joe
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Thats fine but things are never what they seem and a little knowledge is a dangerous thing in the hands of a hi-fi enthusiast, because he suddenly becomes a forum *expert* telling others what to do.

If I had a tenner for every bit of crap spouted on forums I would be a rich man, and it is all people who *think* they have knowledge. Maybe they have a few basic bits of test gear and then they can become arrogant forum monsters, or become reviewers. :rolleyes:

All that numbers and bullshit explanations of design do is give you a *very* basic point to start from. I have been doing it for over 40 years and every month or year or two it surprises me with a new understanding that often contradicts the old one, but the numbers haven't changed.
 
(I blame Spock's Brain for that, but the third season had several weak episodes.)
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But it did have that wonderful episode where Kirks mind is transfered into a womans body.

I think it was the very last episode of all.
 
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Richard Dunn said:
Thats fine but things are never what they seem and a little knowledge is a dangerous thing in the hands of a hi-fi enthusiast, because he suddenly becomes a forum *expert* telling others what to do.

If I had a tenner for every bit of crap spouted on forums I would be a rich man, and it is all people who *think* they have knowledge. Maybe they have a few basic bits of test gear and then they can become arrogant forum monsters, or become reviewers. :rolleyes:

All that numbers and bullshit explanations of design do is give you a *very* basic point to start from. I have been doing it for over 40 years and every month or year or two it surprises me with a new understanding that often contradicts the old one, but the numbers haven't changed.
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A little knowledge is ok, people can often deal with that but the real problem comes from those with no knowledge whatsoever, usually those placing 100% faith in subjectivism IME. I use the word 'faith' deliberately.

A classic example is a discussion in process at the moment in another place where a particularly enlightened subjectivist is claiming that the choice of support rack is important as it grounds the vibrations existing within power transistors, and that this is audible.
It is bollox, plain and simple faith based tosh and it should be challenged.

As for numbers, well it depends what numbers you choose to examine. Widen the net and there is a reasonable explanation for everything in audio - it isn't a particularly complex subject!
 
Rob,

Are you disagreeing with the chap that racks don't affect the sound of power transistors specifically or non-mechanical devices in general?

regards,

dave
 
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blackdog said:
Rob,

Are you disagreeing with the chap that racks don't affect the sound of power transitors specifically or non-mechanical devices in general?

regards,

dave
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How a power transistor is mounted in the case effects the sound, how that case is made and fixed together effects the sound, so it is not a great leap to think maybe what the case is standing on effects the sound. Some of these changes are very small, but they all add up, and quite often without some you cannot hear the others, and there is no technical explanation for that.
 
As has already been pointed out elsewhere, if transistors were sensitive to vibration, active speakers wouldn't work.

It's hard to think of subjectivism as anything other than inventing problems that do not need solutions.
 
RobHolt said:
A little knowledge is ok, people can often deal with that but the real problem comes from those with no knowledge whatsoever, usually those placing 100% faith in subjectivism IME. I use the word 'faith' deliberately.
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So you put your faith in test equipment and numbers. I use the word "faith" deliberately.
 
Basil said:
As has already been pointed out elsewhere, if transistors were sensitive to vibration, active speakers wouldn't work.

It's hard to think of subjectivism as anything other than inventing problems that do not need solutions.
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Who said anything about external vibration or microphony. That happens but it is more a valve problem. I wouldn't produce an active loudspeaker for another reason. If you want to use decently large power supplies then they have to be external, so if they are external and you need DC umbilicals you might as well build the amp in the box as well.

Coils produce fields and fields interact!
 
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