Why do you visit audio forums?

[Joe Petrik]

Richard,

If I had a tenner for every bit of crap spouted on forums I would be a rich man...

Me, too. I'd be stinking rich, like Mick Parry.

But where you pick up on some misunderstanding of Ohm's law I see the punter who can't distinguish between, say, Spock's Brain and Amok Time.

OK, both are Spock episodes, but that's where the similarities end.

Joe

 

[Dave Simpson]

Don't make me get the frying pan and superglue out Basil ;-)

Seriously, do you believe the research and results regarding circuit microphony by engineers at NVA, Naim, Linn, etc is malarky?

 

[Richard Dunn]

Then you seem not to know what the word 'faith' means.

I own a dictionary and if I can't find it I can always google it

 

[Dave Simpson]

How a power transistor is mounted in the case effects the sound, how that case is made and fixed together effects the sound, so it is not a great leap to think maybe what the case is standing on effects the sound. Some of these changes are very small, but they all add up, and quite often without some you cannot hear the others, and there is no technical explanation for that.

I have no doubt as my ears have picked up on it consistently and reliably for the last forty years.

 

[Richard Dunn]

engineers at NVA

well apart from me there is my cat.

 

[Basil]

Don't make me get the frying pan and superglue out Basil ;-)

Seriously, do you believe the research and results regarding circuit microphony by engineers at NVA, Naim, Linn, etc is malarky?

Yes, because the equipment used in recording studios decades before Linn, Naim and NVA existed, seems to work Ok.

Do you only listen to Linn and Naim recordings?

Has NVA made any? And if the answer is yes, I have recordings of myself singing to the cat, you can keep them!

 

[Dave Simpson]

OK isn't definitive, it's merely OK.

Reminds me of the argument about "how could the last six feet of power cord make a difference with the miles of bog standard stuff to the power station." My reply would be has anyone replaced the miles of bog standard stuff all the way back to the power station with better stuff to see if we do or don't get even more of an improvement?

 

[Basil]

OK isn't definitive, it's merely OK.

F***ing pedant!

Yes, because the equipment used in recording studios decades before Linn, Naim and NVA existed, works brilliantly.


Is that better!!!!

 

[Dave Simpson]

LOL...yes, better;-)

P.S. I currently have six or seven Naim recordings, no Linn recordings and approx. 2000 other non-audiophile CDs with the exception of a Quad/Lyra (?) classical sampler I bought at a thrift shop out of curiousity. Back when I did records, it was three Linn records IIRC and either 13,467 or 13,468 non-audiophile LPs.

EDIT: Just remembered, I do have a copy of Coltrane's "Ballads" on CD remastered by Linn.

 

[Basil]

LOL...yes, better;-)

P.S. I currently have six or seven Naim recordings, no Linn recordings and approx. 2000 other non-audiophile CDs with the exception of a Quad/Lyra (?) classical sampler I bought at a thrift shop out of curiousity. Back when I did records, it was three Linn records IIRC and either 13,467 or 13,468 non-audiophile records.

You no longer play records, how on earth can you claim to be a fruit-loop subjectivist and not claim records are bestest?

Stone the heretic!

On a slightly more serious note,

None of this stuff (special stands, cables, both mains and signal, cable lifters and so on) is used to make the recording, why is this stuff necessary to play them?

 

[Dave Simpson]

You no longer play records, how on earth can you claim to be a fruit-loop subjectivist and not claim records are bestest?

Stone the heretic!

On a slightly more serious note,

None of this stuff (special stands, cables, both mains and signal, cable lifters and so on) is used to make the recording, why is it necessary to play them?

General Petrik has yet to get back to me with a label. I guess I'm destined to wander the Earth aimlessly.

It's not necessary, just a pleasure enhancement. Honestly, you'd be surprised just how non-tweaky and conventional I really am when it comes to hifi setup. I've found through decades of experience the few rules most manufacturers give for setup is sufficient and major deviations usually degrade performance.

 

[Richard Dunn]

Yes, because the equipment used in recording studios decades before Linn, Naim and NVA existed, seems to work Ok.

Do you only listen to Linn and Naim recordings?

Has NVA made any? And if the answer is yes, I have recordings of myself singing to the cat, you can keep them!

Well there was a recording I made at the age of 14 on my fathers tape "machine" of me farting, but I am afraid I have lost it.

 

[Richard Dunn]

You no longer play records, how on earth can you claim to be a fruit-loop subjectivist and not claim records are bestest?

Stone the heretic!

On a slightly more serious note,

None of this stuff (special stands, cables, both mains and signal, cable lifters and so on) is used to make the recording, why is this stuff necessary to play them?

Of course it is, all old studio gear was built like a brick ****house, and as far as I am concerned most of the stand bit is putting back in the rigidity and mass that could have been there in the first place. Remember all pro gear either has its own stand or is rigidly mounted in a 19inch rack. Of course some things are bonkers like cable lifters, same with Belt stuff, but you tar sensible usable stuff with the same brush.

Just because there are conmen, slurpers and crooks doesn't mean everyone is.

 

[Dave Simpson]

Of course it is, all old studio gear was built like a brick ****house, and as far as I am concerned most of the stand bit is putting back in the rigidity and mass that could have been there in the first place. Remember all pro gear either has its own stand or is rigidly mounted in a 19inch rack. Of course some things are bonkers like cable lifters, same with Belt stuff, but you tar sensible usable stuff with the same brush.

Just because there are conmen, slurpers and crooks doesn't mean everyone is.

Good point about the rigidity and mass thing with rack mounting.

One thing the objectivists never seem to touch on is the fact that many if not all subjectivists report negative results with tweaks.

 

[Basil]

One thing the objectivists never seem to touch on is the fact that many if not all subjectivists report negative results with tweaks.

Reallly? It always seems to be this "I tried rubbing maple syrup into my mains lead and it made the sound much sweeter" sort of thing!



I always thought the stuff was bolted into racks to stop some feckless muso stealing it!

Nothing spiked though, nothing that remotely resembles mana or fraim?

It was built from dexion.

 

[Dave Simpson]

Reallly? It always seems to be this "I tried rubbing maple syrup into my mains lead and it made the sound much sweeter" sort of thing!



I always thought the stuff was bolted into racks to stop some feckless muso stealing it!

Nothing spiked though, nothing that remotely resembles mana or fraim?

It was built from dexion.

I agree you don't see the negative stuff mentioned enough. I try and make up for that by posting more negative than positive reviews when it comes to tweaks. I doubt I've ever found more then five or six good ones ever anyway.

Rack mounting as I understand it is more for a tidy and orderly installation, proper grounding and convenience in daily use and servicing. A hidden benefit may very well be for sonics with mass loading and rigidity as Richard suggests.

Spikes as I undertand it from audio engineers is a defined point of contact. In other words, they know why they are using it and what it will or won't do.

 

[Richard Dunn]

Reallly? It always seems to be this "I tried rubbing maple syrup into my mains lead and it made the sound much sweeter" sort of thing!



I always thought the stuff was bolted into racks to stop some feckless muso stealing it!

Nothing spiked though, nothing that remotely resembles mana or fraim?

It was built from dexion.

The two people who are completely wrong in this argument are the extremists, and on one side you have the likes of Basil and on the other you have the likes of Peter Belt, both as nutty as each other. The more balanced argument is with the likes of Rob and Simon on one side and Blackdog and me on the other, at least we can validate parts of the argument on each side.

 

[James_1D]

Because its nice to know there are other people out there spending their hard earned cash on hi-fi to get more enjoyment out of their music....most of my friends think I'm mad spending what I do on hi-fi........water off a ducks back.....fine if they want to get 40% of the picture.....me I want as close to 100% as my money will allow me !

 

[sq225917]

Don't make me get the frying pan and superglue out Basil ;-)

Seriously, do you believe the research and results regarding circuit microphony by engineers at NVA, Naim, Linn, etc is malarky?

I'm seen no published, measured researched on microphony from either of these three brands in the past 30 years. Do you have access to some unpublished data that we don't.

In fact I've never seen any microphony data from any manufacture that didn't relate to turntables; though I'm sure some will exist for reel to reel tape.

Produce the data or renounce the claim.

As Richard rightly stated, apart from mechanical parts, it's a valve thing...




Do you not think it funny, all it would take to validate an entire section of the hifi accessories market would be one instance of showing noise overlaid onto the signal via microphony, surely with all their money they could cobble that together were it true?

 

[RobHolt]

Rob,

Are you disagreeing with the chap that racks don't affect the sound of power transistors specifically or non-mechanical devices in general?

regards,

dave

They have no audible effect on solid state electronics .

Turntable yes sometimes, tube amplifiers again sometimes but everything else, no.
I've described a perfectly good and extreme test that anyone can perform to prove this to themselves.

I ditched racks a few years ago when I decided that I needed to house some 3000+ vinyl albums and needed the space.
So I chose a housing for my records that could also act as a platform for the equipment, and look neat and tidy.
Sounds absolutely fine and no worse than the Sound Org floor stands it replaced.